Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Discussion of hardware and software development for Super NES and Super Famicom.

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XtraSmiley
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by XtraSmiley » Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:16 am

jwdonal wrote:
XtraSmiley wrote:Is there any update to this project? I'm curious what you're planning to do now that Kevin's system is coming out.
Hi! Kevin's system has no bearing on my plans. You might want to read back on the thread a bit. When I'm ready I'll be starting a crowdfunding campaign to get the entire SNES open sourced along with other goodies as well. ;) My consultant business is swamped with other IP dev work right now so that's taking priority, but don't worry, it'll happen!
XtraSmiley wrote:Any chance you can help with the SD2SNES project and get more special chips programed for them?
Yeah, I'm definitely interested. I think that would be a neat project.

Cya!
Thanks for the replies. I did read the whole thread, but...

You were looking to get paid for all your work on this (and I am NOT saying you shouldn't be), but now that Kevin is releasing his via a system that basically cost about $200 delivered, I'm not sure I see a way for you to make your time in "money" back on this. So, that being said, what is your plan? Are you going to release for free? Help out Buyuu with his SNES emulator? etc?

I'm not sure you'll be able to raise the kind of money you would have been able to 6 months ago, I know it sucks, but I just think that's where we are today. What are your real thoughts on that?

Thanks for offering to look into the SD2SNES. I doubt you could make a lot of money on something like that, but if that is what drives you, set up a Patreon, with the goal to make that happen. I bet that would generate some buzz.

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jwdonal
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by jwdonal » Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:58 pm

XtraSmiley wrote:You were looking to get paid for all your work on this (and I am NOT saying you shouldn't be), but now that Kevin is releasing his via a system that basically cost about $200 delivered, I'm not sure I see a way for you to make your time in "money" back on this. So, that being said, what is your plan?
I've told you my plan. :) I'm not interested in competing with Kevin's console and I'm not interested in making a commercial product as I've said multiple times in the past. I also don't make PCBs. My private consulting company makes custom FPGA IP cores and throws them over the fence to our customers. Now granted we do work with COTS FPGA boards, but we don't make our own. Obviously I have to prioritize my (and my other contractor's) time to my paying business customers over SNES development - they pay much better. Lol. :)

My target audience is totally different from Analogue's closed-source, closed-hardware commercial system. If I had intended on making something like that I would have stopped working on my SNES a long time ago when I originally found out about it in December 2016 when Chris Taber contacted me. Lol. Because there is no way my company could have gotten it out the door prior to the release date that Analogue had planned - I simply don't have the man-power given all of our other contracting work. SNES can't take priority over my core business customers - that would be a pretty stupid move on my part.

My number one goal when working on this console and others is always to have fun and learn cool stuff. Period. I don't have enough motivation to do it for any other reason. :P It's amazing how much of a better FPGA designer I have become re-creating these old consoles. And Kevin is part of that too because he's taught me so much over the last many years. Hell, Kevin is so talented sometimes I think you could just stand next to him and learn purely through osmosis! XD

In any case, my point is (and I've stated this before), if the campaign is funded great, if not great. Remember that I never intended to release the source in any way/shape/form. I created the SNES for _myself_ to have fun, not for anyone else. It was someone else's idea to crowd fund and open source it, not mine. :)
XtraSmiley wrote:Are you going to release for free?
I'm sure China would love that, but, no....HAHA. If they want the source they can pay for it.
XtraSmiley wrote:Help out Byuu with his SNES emulator? etc?
Yes, I'll probably release all of my test ROMs eventually regardless.
XtraSmiley wrote:What are your real thoughts on that?
I've given you my real thoughts. I don't think I have fake ones... XD
XtraSmiley wrote:Thanks for offering to look into the SD2SNES. I doubt you could make a lot of money on something like that, but if that is what drives you, set up a Patreon, with the goal to make that happen. I bet that would generate some buzz.
It's not about "makin' money", it's about what's fair and not letting other's inappropriately profit from my hard work.

Cya!

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olddb
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by olddb » Sun Dec 03, 2017 4:16 pm

Regardless, don't stop posting new videos.
...

XtraSmiley
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by XtraSmiley » Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:49 am

Thanks for the detailed replies! OK, we can't wait to see what's next!

inspuration
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by inspuration » Fri Dec 15, 2017 2:57 pm

Wow this is amazing! I used a DE2 a few years ago for some EE courses in school and I loved the thing. Of course its been a while and I haven't used it in years but I think this could be an invaluable learning opportunity for students.

I understand the potential minefield of issues with releasing it but perhaps there is some way that you could license it to interested learners while still preventing it from being used/abused commercially.

I'm no expert but I seem to recall altera had some sort of scheme like this for their nios cores. I believe you could encrypt certain parts of the source code or use an IP core locking solution: https://www.altera.com/solutions/partne ... ystem.html


Cheers

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James-F
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by James-F » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:26 pm

@jwdonal,
I think if you want to contribute to the emulation scene or SD2SNES project you just need to start a kickstarter and name your terms.
You will find that people are generous and willing to donate so you can work on the special chips in the SD2SNES while being assured that everything is fair and square by your terms.
But you have to be absolutely sure that it is possible on the current SD2SNES hardware before starting a kickstarter.

benvanik
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by benvanik » Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:47 pm

Just wanted to chime in and say that work towards an FPGA SA-1 (and others) for use on flash carts or repro carts would be amazing. I'm looking at doing homebrew that uses the SA-1 but don't want to desecrate a donation cart to get one nor would I want to release homebrew that encouraged others to do so. Would gladly patreon/kickstart/moral support such efforts :)

idc
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by idc » Sat Jan 27, 2018 4:23 am

jwdonal wrote:In any case, my point is (and I've stated this before), if the campaign is funded great, if not great. Remember that I never intended to release the source in any way/shape/form. I created the SNES for _myself_ to have fun, not for anyone else. It was someone else's idea to crowd fund and open source it, not mine. :)
Well I've ordered a Retro Nt, since it's a very nice looking thing, and it should be supported.

That said, I'd happily throw a contribution into the VeriSNES project also, if it means an open source release. No reason why we can't have both.

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James-F
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by James-F » Sat Jan 27, 2018 7:51 am

@jwdonal
Are you alive?

@idc
I (and thousands like me) want S-Video and RGB like the original for authentic experience on a CRT,,, which the Super Nt doesn't deliver.
I don't care for HDMI, I have emulators with 99.99% compatibility that look and play just as good.

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LuigiBlood
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by LuigiBlood » Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:52 am

James-F wrote:@jwdonal
Are you alive?

@idc
I (and thousands like me) want S-Video and RGB like the original for authentic experience on a CRT,,, which the Super Nt doesn't deliver.
I don't care for HDMI, I have emulators with 99.99% compatibility that look and play just as good.
You kind of missed out because Analogue announced a way to do S-Video, RGB and stuff for the Super NT.

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FitzRoy
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by FitzRoy » Sat Jan 27, 2018 3:07 pm

Digital signals can be downconverted to analog ones with an adapter. There's... no problem here at all with the nt design.

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James-F
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by James-F » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:14 pm

FitzRoy wrote:Digital signals can be downconverted to analog ones with an adapter.
Analog signals can be upconverted to digital ones with an adapter.... like the OSSC. :lol:
In that case I don't need the Super Nt... AND have the original console AND Composite, S-Video, RGB and HDMI outputs;
Can't get more authentic and lag-free than that.
The original Super Famicoms still plentiful on ebay for a dime on a dollar (cheap).

Keep in mind that the only difference between the Super Nt and a good emulator box (that plays cartridges) experience-wise is only the lag time.

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MottZilla
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by MottZilla » Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:02 pm

LuigiBlood wrote:
James-F wrote:@jwdonal
Are you alive?

@idc
I (and thousands like me) want S-Video and RGB like the original for authentic experience on a CRT,,, which the Super Nt doesn't deliver.
I don't care for HDMI, I have emulators with 99.99% compatibility that look and play just as good.
You kind of missed out because Analogue announced a way to do S-Video, RGB and stuff for the Super NT.
What announcement?

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LuigiBlood
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by LuigiBlood » Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:01 pm

From Analogue Twitter: https://twitter.com/analogue_co/status/ ... 1138093057
For all analog AV lovers: we've been working on something you'll like. 100% work in progress at this time, but coming together right so far.
Designed for Super Nt and future Analogue systems. A digital to analog converter that plugs into the HDMI port.
It takes proprietary digital signals from Super Nt and converts them to high quality analog signals. Outputs to same DSUB15 jack on Nt mini.
Outputs: RGB, Component, S-video, Composite, analog audio...and probably more. Same quality as Nt mini. Zero lag. Zero signal degradation.
Price will be reasonable.

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FitzRoy
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Re: Introducing the VeriSNES (FPGA-based SNES)

Post by FitzRoy » Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:34 pm

James-F wrote: Analog signals can be upconverted to digital ones with an adapter....
But then you're getting analog quality through a digital connector. You can't recreate lost information with the same success as reducing it.

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