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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:23 am 
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I guess it's not my buisne$$$$$$$$

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:27 am 
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No it isnt.

[sarcasm]
COMMUNIST!!!!!
[/sarcasm]


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:17 am 
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Honnestly, since when are people paid to have fun ?
Most people on the earth works in order to earn money and spend that money to get food and have fun. I just don't like that this rule is broken, it just isn't right that some peopl should work to earn money while others can have fun to earn the same money, when they should spend their earned money to have fun instead. Is that communism ? If so I guess I am one of them (altough I never undersant what communism is despite the fact I was supposed to have learned that at scool).

Anyway, to anyone who reads that I am *not* going to buy any NE$ "homebrew" games no matter what anyone says. I am interested in NESdev not NE$dev

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:36 am 
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Some people just need a financial incentive to keep them from getting pulled to the Dark Side (Pocket PC homebrew).


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:34 am 
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Bregalad wrote:
Honnestly, since when are people paid to have fun ?
Most people on the earth works in order to earn money and spend that money to get food and have fun. I just don't like that this rule is broken, it just isn't right that some peopl should work to earn money while others can have fun to earn the same money, when they should spend their earned money to have fun instead. Is that communism ? If so I guess I am one of them (altough I never undersant what communism is despite the fact I was supposed to have learned that at scool).

Anyway, to anyone who reads that I am *not* going to buy any NE$ "homebrew" games no matter what anyone says. I am interested in NESdev not NE$dev


Isnt the idea of life that its unfair. Ya I know its unfair......but it is. Also note the sarcasm notes at the communist remark...how old are you btw...no offense I find it hard to imagine anyone over 18 to not know what communism is (no offense here)


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:58 pm 
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Bregalad wrote:
Honnestly, since when are people paid to have fun ?
Most people on the earth works in order to earn money and spend that money to get food and have fun. I just don't like that this rule is broken, it just isn't right that some peopl should work to earn money while others can have fun to earn the same money, when they should spend their earned money to have fun instead.


Many of the people I know would fall into that category. Granted, they had to go through school to get there, but they seem to enjoy their work. Isn't that the difference between a job and a career, the enjoyment?

If not then I need to change my major to something less enjoyable. :)

edit: I know the topic is nesdev, but your comment seemed aimed at work in general. If not, then my mistake.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 2:41 pm 
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I aim to do what I enjoy to make a living. And well, not just a living, but like so I'll never have to work again. It's okay for me to have this goal, because like a lot of other people, I don't want to be condemned to do the same boring crap every day for the rest of my life until I die after living the average life span. Though once I achieve this goal, I will make movies, books, games, music, and lots more (so I'll do work, it will be mostly for my own benefit though). Then of course I'll buy myself a huge house with a roller coaster inside and lots of sound proof rooms :) .

And whether or not you're 18 has nothing to do with your understanding of communism. There are plenty of things I don't understand about life that are supposedly common sense that I apparently should understand by this point. Some things are just harder to understand than others. I myself don't fully understand communism.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 2:44 pm 
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Yes you are right, it's of course possible to have a job and enjoy it, but after all it's still a job. Coding NES games is not a job any longer since 1994. If anyone wants to make commercial games, I'm not standing against them, but they should definitely be making games that are actually commercialisable like PS3, XBox360, Wii, DS, or PC games (possibly GBA but I doubt). Not NES games, as much as I like these they are not commercial anymore and shoudn't be IMO.

I'm currently 19 and yes I know about communism I just don't understand exactly what it is. Of course I am supposed to have learned it at scool, but I almost only listened to math courses.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 2:53 pm 
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Ah I thought you had absolutly no understanding of communism. Anyway atariage has lots of people selling games. Just cause a game console is old doesnt mean you cant commericially program for it. Hell the dreamcast stil gets games.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:01 pm 
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You can but :
1) Very few people will actually buy it -> your chances to make a living are slim to none
2) Chances are that it will be considered rare and that people will sell it more expensive than the original price on ebay, something I would personally have if the game was mine
3) You are getting informations, help and progamming tools on the internet by people who shared that freely and you use that to make money, which I consider dishonnest. If anyone release a game chances are that people writing tile editors and assember, as well as people that answers to questions asqued on the internet, are as much responsible in the release than the coder.
4) If everyone had that mentaily, we would then have to buy emulator, romhacks, roms, etc... and in the end it would be detestable, I'd just play modern games that come out they have better graphics and would be almost less expensive at that rate
5) Where is the fun ? I love programming and such. After all a game is a work of art, and I personally think an artistic ideal should become before money.

Wanting to be a sersious money maker when coding a game for a completely obsolete machine just doesn't feel right. Especially

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:13 pm 
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Number 3 actually brings up a valid point. I can see why someone would feel it's cheap/dishonest to use all this free stuff to make money. Those people who answered the questions that the programmer had play a big part in the production of that game. Though it may be small in comparison to what work the programmer did.

I sort of agree with number 4 and 5 too. But I'm not as passionately adamant about them.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:26 pm 
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Bregalad wrote:
If anyone wants to make commercial games, I'm not standing against them, but they should definitely be making games that are actually my mom

Please use American spelling of -ize words on this board. Otherwise, the censor thinks you're trying to talk about a medication sold by Lilly ICOS to treat erectile dysfunction.

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like PS3, XBox360, Wii, DS, or PC games (possibly GBA but I doubt).

So how does one get the money to buy a devkit and lease an office in order to qualify for a PS3, Xbox 360, Wii, or DS license?

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Not NES games, as much as I like these they are not commercial anymore and shoudn't be IMO.

Apart from famiclones and "plug and play TV games" based on NOACs.

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Chances are that it will be considered rare and that people will sell it more expensive than the original price on ebay, something I would personally have if the game was mine

If you're seeing prices for your work on eBay shoot up, then start another eBay account and covertly auction "complete near mint" copies of your work. (Unlike Amazon, eBay doesn't frown on multiple accounts.) Or have a friend or relative auction the occasional copy.

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You are getting informations, help and progamming tools on the internet by people who shared that freely and you use that to make money, which I consider dishonnest.

Making money off free software happens outside the retro-console scene. Look at how many PC games and commercial console games were built using GCC, Perl, Lua, FreeType, libpng, IJG libjpeg, Ogg Vorbis, or other free software.

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If everyone had that mentaily, we would then have to buy emulator, romhacks, roms, etc

But look at the emergence of GNU/Linux and FreeBSD into a world dominated by commercial UNIX. This shows shows that not every developer will have that mentality.

There's nothing wrong with making or taking a Free engine and then putting proprietary assets on top of it. The ability to combine free software with other value-added products or services is one of the main draws of free software.


Last edited by tepples on Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:29 pm 
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So if you were to write a Windows game in C++ with Notepad++, create the graphics with GIMP, and compile it with the MinGW32 compiler, it would be morally wrong to sell it?

[edit]
what tepples said. -_-

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Last edited by BMF54123 on Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:31 pm 
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Considering it's the NES, a lot of things are readily available that would replace this.

"Geminim"? Just find one of the other ten billion variations of Nim (or don't bother, since it's solved)

Siamond? There are a billion clones of Simon already, just go find one of those.

Mystic Pillars? Play Magic Jewelry instead. Or hell, Columns on the Genesis or Game Gear/MS.

Charging money for these things -- Literally half the price of a brand new game for PS3/XB360/etc -- is ... prohibitively expensive.



Oh, on that note, I noticed that Retrozone no longer sells EEPROMs or mappers. Gee, I wonder why.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:34 pm 
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I dont think siv is trying "to make a living out of this". Just some extra pocket change. Also....if the authors of a program do not wish the program to be used to make commercial stuff...they should put a disclaimer on it. That should cover it.


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