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PostPosted: Tue Jul 19, 2005 9:04 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 4:25 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Norway
Download:
http://www.geocities.com/matrixz15/nn2_ntsc.zip

edit: optional link, pick your preference:
http://elazulspad.net/matrixz/nn2_ntsc.zip

This is a project ive been working on for about a
year, keeping sort of low-profile on it. Never knew
when i would finish it, and i didnt want to release it
before it was complete. Its based off NeSnake,
my entry in the 2004 minigame compo. I wanted to
improve the graphics on it, add music, thats how this
thing started. Then i added more and more, and it ended
up as what best Snake/Nibbles-like game i managed to
achieve with 32k of ROM space. (and 8k CHR)
Yep, its a full release, no demo. Its good to finnaly publish
it out, belive me.

On the game, there are 25 levels in all, and some useful items you
can get. There's a 2-player mode, for play against
a buddy or the AI coded into the game :)

There's a PAL version coming up, but it has some slight problems
i have to fix first. The PAL version was testen on hardware to work,
but there's no reason the NTSC version shouldnt.

I guess i'll just let the game speak.

Screens:

Image

Image

Image

I wont be able to reply the next 4 days, since i'll be on a trip.


Last edited by Matrixz on Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 2:53 am 
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Posts: 3482
Location: Indianapolis
I haven't played all the levels yet, but it's really cool so far.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 1:48 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 2:49 pm
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Location: Chexbres, VD, Switzerland
It's very cool and decent !
Congrats !

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 10:22 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:31 am
Posts: 418
NeSnake is a great game! I am glad you have decided to further improve it. Snake in itself is a very simple gameplay concept, like Sokoban. I think a heavily themed version of Snake is a good idea, just as Lolo is a heavily themed version of Sokoban and Super Puzzle Fighter is a heavily themed verison of Tetris. The kernel gameplay is fun in and of itself, but improved graphics and audio and possibly a little story really make it better. So how about, will you release a third version of NeSnake that is as themed as Lolo is for Sokoban?

BTW, another great theme-ing of Sokoban is Mole Mania for the Super Gameboy. It is on par with Lolo's theme-ing. Sure it would be hard to fully theme Snake with a story, but if it can be done for Sokoban and Tetris, it should be possible for Snake.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 5:12 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:31 am
Posts: 418
Ok, I got some more play time. I am not used to playing worms with absolute controls and instead I am used to relative controls for turning. I was playing with the latest FCE Ultra under Linux. I absolutely love the music! The graphics are pretty good too, and I love how it has an in game instruction manual. I wish all games did that. I still haven't beaten easy. I assume that would unlock the next difficulty level. Does the game have a cinematic ending?

Some ideas for NeSnake 3:
1. level editor, with custom levels saved to SRAM
2. four score support for up to 4 player multiplayer
3. more variety in power ups
4. more variety and themeing in levels
5. A story for single player adventure mode, possibly with Pacman-like cut scenes for intermission between stages. It doesn't have to by anything special. Maybe you could just be a snake trying to save the princess snake, which was taken captive by a evil team of mongooses and hawks (which eat snakes in the wild). This would allow for more heavy themeing of the levels, powerups, and monsters.
6. Monsters that move around and can kill your snake if they touch the snake's head. This would allow for a strategy involving blocking the monsters with your snake's body.

In conclusion, everybody loved the original NeSnake. NeSnake 2 is definitely an improvement, and I would even go as far as to say that it is the best and most complete NES homebrew so far.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:02 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 4:25 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Norway
Its all good to hear 8)
I've decided to go for a third game, and the development has slightly begun already.

I hope to get someone to do the music and maybe most of the graphics for any third version. I would welcome people to help with level design as well.

As for your ideas:

I planned a custom-level editor, that will definately be there. 4-players at the same time, i think that's impossible. (The NES has limits to how much graphics can be updated each frame, and 4-player would take too much of that). 4-player tournaments with 1v1 per round would work though. Im thinking of much more gameplay elements and power-ups (no ideas yet though). On levels.. for NN3 i will have alot of freedom of spending graphics on levels. I will also do mid-frame effects using the MMC3 mapper and its scanline IRQs. On Story, i never thought about that. It would have to be a engaging story with a purpose, not just something cheap for the sake of it. But i dont feel its the most important thing. Anyway, i like the idea about monsters and blocking them with the snake's body.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:08 am 
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What about changing the versus rules for 2-player mode so that one player cannot block the other player from respawning?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:17 am 
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Location: Chexbres, VD, Switzerland
I think that the snakes should advance slower, because controlling them can be pretty frustrating sometimes, even in easyer levels (when you want to turn just before a wall, but you click a bit too late and it scrateches).

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:26 pm 
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Bregalad wrote:
I think that the snakes should advance slower, because controlling them can be pretty frustrating sometimes, even in easyer levels (when you want to turn just before a wall, but you click a bit too late and it scrateches).


I am not sure why I forgot to mention another feature request for NeSnake 3: the ability to select between relative and absolute controls.

Yeah, I get the feeling too. It seems to have more to do with the fact that you can't turn the milisecond before the snake advances into the wall. The reason you can't do that is because the snake can only turn on a grid with rows and columns the same width as the snake itself. Changing it so that the grid on which the snake aligns has rows and solumns 1 pixel wide would give a better feel, but it would increase the number of graphics tiles needed, right?

Another option would be to let the snake to interrupt partially entering the next grid unit. For example, say that the snake is advancing upwards and has partially entered the next row. If the player turns before the snake has fully entered the next row, then it snaps-back to turning into the previous row in which it has fully entered.

Just suggestions. I am not sure which would make the controls feel more intuitive, but the current controls do seem to take some getting used to, even for those that have lots of experience with other snake-like games.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 9:27 pm 
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Location: Norway
Jagasian wrote:
What about changing the versus rules for 2-player mode so that one player cannot block the other player from respawning?


The reason i put that in is, if the 1st snake respawns above the other snake, it will continue "inside" that 2nd snake, or in many cases crash on part of the 2nd snake the second after the 1st one respawned. So its more fair delaying it until the path is clear.

Bregalad wrote:
I think that the snakes should advance slower, because controlling them can be pretty frustrating sometimes, even in easyer levels (when you want to turn just before a wall, but you click a bit too late and it scrateches).


I might consider changing the speed difficulties if enough people feel its too fast. I didnt have any beta-testers after all.

Jagasian wrote:
I am not sure why I forgot to mention another feature request for NeSnake 3: the ability to select between relative and absolute controls.


Yeah, relative controls was in NN2 since someone wanted it, but space issues had me remove the feature. It will be in NN3.

Jagasian wrote:
Another option would be to let the snake to interrupt partially entering the next grid unit. For example, say that the snake is advancing upwards and has partially entered the next row. If the player turns before the snake has fully entered the next row, then it snaps-back to turning into the previous row in which it has fully entered.


As it currently works, crash detection is done when the snake has fully entered the row below the row with the eventual wall (if direction is upwards). It never hit me, but youre right, ideally it should wait one more frame, at the moment its about to move 1 pixel into the wall. This is fixable without any horrible work-arounds or more graphics. Making it possible to change the direction after you partially entered a 8x8 box.. might make the game feel even better (and still be challenging). It would work, though with a deal of work-around.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 9:42 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 2:04 pm
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Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota, United States
Are you aware of how well that game would do in the arcades!? :P Very proffesional looking! good music! good everything! addictive! nice job!


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 11:53 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2005 11:44 pm
Posts: 10
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Hi,

First I would like to say this game looks absolutely fun!
Secondly, I find the text a little blurry and hard to read.. I think you could improve in this area.. I admit I am slightly medicated right now, but think it could be improved a tad for readability.. I also noticed something with the collision detection and I'm not sure if its been brought up before, but its something I view as incorrect.. If you double back, and the snake needs the rest of its body to be clear of its path, even if you clear it by "one" block, meaning the space NEXT to the head is occupied, but the space infront of it is EMPTY, there is still a collision; is this intended ? I can try and produce a VirtuaNES movie file or something like that if required

Also, I am the editor for Old Skool Games, an electronically distributed gaming magazine that focuses on classic consoles, and I would love to do a piece on your game in one of our next issues..

I know a lot of homebrew folks might consider their titles to be works in progress with the ability for revisions down the road (much like PC games 'patch' stuff) but if you could get into contact with me and discuss providing me with a review copy that you feel best showcases the game to the player, then I'd love to hear from you, and perhaps ask you a few detailed questions about the devlopment process.

You can visit the contacts page of our site, or drop me a PM here with an e-mail address where I could reach you. Hope to hear from you soon!


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 12:19 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 02, 2004 12:07 pm
Posts: 163
Matrixz,
as was the first one, i love your game. the graphics look great. i would probably also say the music is good.... but this computer lacks speakers so i have not heard it yet :( it sure was a surprise to see a new version, i have been working on a new version of my game also (my game still sucks) but i think its really great that the 2004 minigame nes entrys are still being worked on ^_^

also, if you would like i can create an FTP account on elazulspad.net for you so you dont have to use geocities. if you would like this send me a message with the prefered username+password


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:24 am 
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Posts: 418
Zach wrote:
Hi,

I also noticed something with the collision detection and I'm not sure if its been brought up before, but its something I view as incorrect.. If you double back, and the snake needs the rest of its body to be clear of its path, even if you clear it by "one" block, meaning the space NEXT to the head is occupied, but the space infront of it is EMPTY, there is still a collision; is this intended ?


I think what you are describing is related to what Matrixz said earlier in reply to my comment. He mentions a simple fix, which hopefully he will consider including in NeSnake 2, as I can't wait until NeSnake 3 :) See his comment quoted below:

Matrixz wrote:
As it currently works, crash detection is done when the snake has fully entered the row below the row with the eventual wall (if direction is upwards). It never hit me, but youre right, ideally it should wait one more frame, at the moment its about to move 1 pixel into the wall. This is fixable without any horrible work-arounds or more graphics. Making it possible to change the direction after you partially entered a 8x8 box.. might make the game feel even better (and still be challenging). It would work, though with a deal of work-around.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:25 am 
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Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2005 11:44 pm
Posts: 10
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Ah I must have missed that when I read it.. In any case, hope to hear from him soon


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