Alien Isolation

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sdm
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Alien Isolation

Post by sdm » Tue Dec 24, 2019 5:26 am

Code written at the beginning of 2019 (NESASM3, MMC1). I played with a code in which the opponent has a field of view. The code has bugs that I can't fix and is simply badly designed, so it's currently only a curiosity to play. In general, we control a player who must collect all the keys on several screens. We must avoid a Alien who can see and hear us. Small squares flying out of an Alien are his visualized field of view. The big square is the place where the Alien saw / heard us for the last time. The player has three walking modes: Standard (slightly affects the behavior of the Alien), running (Alien hears us) and sneaking (slow, but the Alien, unless he sees us, is unable to hear us). There are broken glasses on the ground that make a loud sound when we walk / run on them. Wooden crates protect us from Alien who cannot kill us there (When he chases us and we hide, after a while he will get bored and leave.)
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Last edited by sdm on Wed Dec 25, 2019 3:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

lancuster
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by lancuster » Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:37 pm

I recommend you to use RLE compression to save space. Because the ROM is too heavy.
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lidnariq
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by lidnariq » Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:54 pm

... uh? the ROM's currently mostly empty. No need to invest in compression yet. (8KB banks #5-#19, #22, #23, #25-#27 are all empty)

lancuster
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by lancuster » Wed Dec 25, 2019 4:02 am

lidnariq wrote:
Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:54 pm
... uh? the ROM's currently mostly empty. No need to invest in compression yet. (8KB banks #5-#19, #22, #23, #25-#27 are all empty)
He never uses compression. In his completed game Micro Knight V1.04, all screens are presented as an open tile map.
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rainwarrior
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by rainwarrior » Wed Dec 25, 2019 6:36 pm

This is cool!

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gauauu
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by gauauu » Wed Dec 25, 2019 10:29 pm

I agree with Rainwarrior: this is cool.
lancuster wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 4:02 am
He never uses compression. In his completed game Micro Knight V1.04, all screens are presented as an open tile map.
So what?

If he delivers the game he wanted to make within the constraints he's happy with, why would he need to compress anything further?

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Memblers
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by Memblers » Thu Dec 26, 2019 12:24 am

It is pretty cool. I wonder if this is technically a "survival horror" game. I know it scares the crap out of me when the alien spots and chases me.

I think I found an exploit with the boxes. Going to the screen below the starting position, hide in that box and the alien will continually walk up/down or left/right. Then when you leave the box, the alien continues to do that, even on new screens it just walks back and forth ignoring the player.

sdm
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by sdm » Thu Dec 26, 2019 3:15 am

I don't know much about compression, that's why I always used the whole nametable :) I have to read about it sometime. Unfortunately, my programming skills are quite poor when it comes to optimizing the size of the code (and not only;))
Memblers wrote:
Thu Dec 26, 2019 12:24 am
I think I found an exploit with the boxes. Going to the screen below the starting position, hide in that box and the alien will continually walk up/down or left/right. Then when you leave the box, the alien continues to do that, even on new screens it just walks back and forth ignoring the player.
There is another problem with the Alien hanging when moving between screens. It makes no sense to fix the code anymore. The solutions used in this game will certainly be used one day in a more sensible project. ;)

lancuster
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by lancuster » Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:41 am

gauauu wrote:
Wed Dec 25, 2019 10:29 pm
I agree with Rainwarrior: this is cool.
Disagree. The demo is unplayable, the alien overtakes the character every time. It is felt that the author does not test the game, they are too complex.
So what?
If he delivers the game he wanted to make within the constraints he's happy with, why would he need to compress anything further?
The larger the size of the ROM, the more expensive the cost of the cartridge will cost. Given that the quality of games is far from the same Tengen.
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lancuster
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by lancuster » Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:47 am

sdm, why alien can walk through electric fields?
By the way, I would like to see an death animation of the character's when the alien grabs it.

P. S.: by the way, what about your Jet Set Willy port? The project is abandoned or will be in progress?
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sdm
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by sdm » Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:59 am

The game has not finished so there are not many things. It's all game concepts, whether they will be completed I do not know, it all depends on time and desire (I do not do it for money, everything hobby).

The Jet Set Willy engine is almost ready, all I have to do is design the levels (not 100% identical). I will definitely want to finish it.

lidnariq
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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by lidnariq » Thu Dec 26, 2019 12:26 pm

Where are you finding prices such that the cost difference between a new 32KB ROM and a new 256KB ROM is large enough to be relevant?

Every time I've looked into manufacturing cartridges for legacy video game consoles, the price really boils down to paying per part, not per size of each part. So there's value in not exceeding 512KB ROMs, because no 5V larger ones are affordable (Macronix's 5V 8mbit part is $2.28/@100, and Alliance's 8 and 16mbit parts are $6.80/@100 and $7.61/@100), but otherwise, compression is a bad investment of developer resources. The end user won't ever see whether the data is compressed or not.

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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by tepples » Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:46 pm

lidnariq wrote:
Thu Dec 26, 2019 12:26 pm
Where are you finding prices such that the cost difference between a new 32KB ROM and a new 256KB ROM is large enough to be relevant?
One needs extra support circuitry (74*161 and 74*32 in the case of UOROM); the other doesn't. I'm finding the same thing at Catskull Electronics: the readily available Game Boy flash carts are 32 KiB because they lack a mapper.
lidnariq wrote:
Thu Dec 26, 2019 12:26 pm
the price really boils down to paying per part, not per size of each part.
Until you get to more complex mappers that need a bigger CPLD.
lidnariq wrote:
Thu Dec 26, 2019 12:26 pm
So there's value in not exceeding 512KB ROMs, because no 5V larger ones are affordable (Macronix's 5V 8mbit part is $2.28/@100, and Alliance's 8 and 16mbit parts are $6.80/@100 and $7.61/@100), but otherwise, compression is a bad investment of developer resources. The end user won't ever see whether the data is compressed or not.
If a game isn't compelling enough for distribution on a cartridge by itself, then inclusion on a multicart may be the only way that a game sees physical release at all. Games using less ROM space are more attractive for multicart inclusion.

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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by lidnariq » Thu Dec 26, 2019 7:40 pm

tepples wrote:
Thu Dec 26, 2019 6:46 pm
I'm finding the same thing at Catskull Electronics: the readily available Game Boy flash carts are 32 KiB because they lack a mapper.
The problem there is that the volume market is unlicensed reproductions, and that means one has to add a whole bunch more parts to support that. I've been eyeing making an explicitly-incompatible board for a while, but I honestly expect I'd get exactly one buyer: you.
tepples wrote:Until you get to more complex mappers that need a bigger CPLD.
The other support hardware is largely irrelevant to the question of size of game. Both UNROM and MMC3 can be found with 128KB of PRG ROM.
tepples wrote:If a game isn't compelling enough for distribution on a cartridge by itself, then inclusion on a multicart may be the only way that a game sees physical release at all.
Yes, but so what? We're not in a time where support from a publisher is necessary, you can self-publish pretty easily. Yes, you may have to front the production costs yourself, but that's really not so onerous for a small run, given the availability of MINDKIDS or COOLBOY based carts.

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Re: Alien Isolation

Post by tepples » Thu Dec 26, 2019 8:11 pm

I'm talking about, say, three games that might not be able to reach a crowdfunding goal at $30 per copy of each game, but people might be willing to buy a bundle of all three on one cart for $40. It's why Gravnic got bundled with Puzznic, it's why Fish Fall got bundled with Sunday Funday, and it's the same reason that a printed newspaper includes all the sections, even the ones you're not interested in.

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