Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

A place that you can discuss reproduction of classic titles or "licensed-for-reproduction" homebrew for personal use.

Moderators: B00daW, Moderators

Forum rules
1. NO BLATANT PIRACY. This includes reproducing homebrew less than 10 years old, with the exception of free software.
2. No advertising your reproductions, with the exception of free software.
3. Be nice. See RFC 1855 if you aren't sure what this means.
User avatar
Fisher
Posts: 1114
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 9:58 am
Location: -29.794229 -55.795374

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by Fisher » Mon Sep 28, 2020 8:31 am

Mine I used an ordinary 27c010.
I think a similar 8bit EPROM, EEPROM or FLASH should work fine.

lidnariq
Posts: 9766
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by lidnariq » Mon Sep 28, 2020 12:46 pm

The presence of the KS-201, along with the writes to $4Axx, means that our documentation of mapper 312's register at $6000 has to be wrong.

User avatar
Fisher
Posts: 1114
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 9:58 am
Location: -29.794229 -55.795374

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by Fisher » Mon Sep 28, 2020 5:22 pm

I think there are some confusion.
The KS-201 chip is another mapper and the ROM probably is incompatible with the discrete logic one.
I think the mapper 312's description is correct, since I could clone it with the help of @lidnariq and @krzysiobal.
I also discovered that the small "glitched" line I saw is present even on the original cartridge, so I consider this clone pretty close to the original.

lidnariq
Posts: 9766
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by lidnariq » Mon Sep 28, 2020 5:50 pm

That depends on what the definition of mapper 312 is. If it means specifically the Kaiser release on the KS-7013 PCB that contains a KS-201 ASIC, and rewired as it is that's what handles the UNROM-style banking, then the definition for PRG bankswitching has to be something more like mapper 554. Specifics are unclear: having quickly done the math, I don't see how swapping only /ROMSEL and CPU /A14 would keep mapper 554's A13-based behavior from getting in the way.

That the game also has usable writes to $6000 and $6E36 only means that Kaiser made it possible to make a copy without using the KS-201, not advice about what version we consider canonical.

User avatar
Fisher
Posts: 1114
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 9:58 am
Location: -29.794229 -55.795374

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by Fisher » Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:46 pm

Oh yeah, now I understood what you meant.
Looking that way there's still confusion.
Very smart move from Kaiser, making a big batch of (mask?) ROMs that could be used with discrete logic or with a specific mapper.

What would be cheaper to produce back on the day, an ASIC(?) or the discrete logic mapper?
Maybe the ASIC was made with some kind of programmable logic?

lidnariq
Posts: 9766
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by lidnariq » Mon Sep 28, 2020 9:56 pm

I haven't really been able to find much useful information about historical costs for things. Sometimes I find a copy of some electronics magazine mentioning prices in small quantity in an advertisement in the back pages, but those aren't usually very applicable.

Certainly there's a bunch of licensed Famicom games that use ASICs that are awfully simple-looking, such as the Sunsoft-1 and -2 and Bandai's Karaoke Studio (mappers 184, 89, 93, and 188). So I wouldn't be surprised if this calculus was favorable... on the other hand, many of Kaiser's ASICs were used in different ways on different PCBs.

User avatar
tiretrak
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2020 11:29 am

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by tiretrak » Sun Oct 04, 2020 5:31 am

i solder 39sf020 to my broken pcb ,burn rom(without first line) ,i try 2 different rom files but game not working.

Image

i use this table of connections for 39sf020
Attachments
Screenshot_4.png

lidnariq
Posts: 9766
Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:12 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by lidnariq » Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:47 pm

Pin 31 needs to be tied to Vcc.
Pin 24 needs to be tied to Vss.
Pin 30 needs to be tied to one or the other, depending on how you programmed the 128KB of data into the PROM.

User avatar
tiretrak
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2020 11:29 am

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by tiretrak » Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:56 pm

lidnariq wrote:
Sun Oct 04, 2020 12:47 pm
Pin 31 needs to be tied to Vcc.
Pin 24 needs to be tied to Vss.
Pin 30 needs to be tied to one or the other, depending on how you programmed the 128KB of data into the PROM.
i try this . no success

i think need special rom for this mapper

User avatar
Fisher
Posts: 1114
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 9:58 am
Location: -29.794229 -55.795374

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by Fisher » Mon Oct 05, 2020 4:49 pm

tiretrak wrote:
Sun Oct 04, 2020 2:56 pm
i think need special rom for this mapper
Probably yes.
Your mapper seems slightly different from the one I used.
The one I used is the mapper 312, I've got information from this wiki page.
I'm adding a "quick and dirty" Eagle drawn schematics, in the hope that it can be useful to someone else.
I used whatever components I had at hand, since the prices of new ones are mostly prohibitive here where I live.
Schematics.png
That's a great way to learn about circuits and logic, specially when you can ask questions to people who have a vast amount of knowledge. :-)
I've learned a little more about how to make a similar function circuit with slightly different components.
That's a nice way to spend free time, in my opinion.

User avatar
tiretrak
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2020 11:29 am

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by tiretrak » Tue Oct 06, 2020 5:37 am

i always have black screen.
i try many roms . before burn I prepared roms with famiROM.exe
is it normal - always black screen ?

User avatar
Fisher
Posts: 1114
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2015 9:58 am
Location: -29.794229 -55.795374

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by Fisher » Tue Oct 06, 2020 8:50 am

Probably you had an undumped pirate ROM.
If this is true, maybe only finding another equal cartridge and dumping the ROM or modifying the board to accept a different ROM.

krzysiobal
Posts: 785
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2011 12:06 pm
Location: Poland

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by krzysiobal » Sun Oct 11, 2020 1:22 am

This one is internesting. The equivalents of russian chips are:
KR1533LL1 = SN74ALS32
K555IE10 = 74LS161
K555LA3 = SN74LS00

But I don't see here enough logic to support this:

Code: Select all

$8001, mask: f0001:
[.... ...m]
         +-- mirroring (0=V, 1=H)
		 
$9001, mask: $f001:
[.... PPP.]
      +++--- 16kB PRG bank at $8000
	  
$8000 | $ffff
------+-------
 PPP  |   7
Maybe $8000 and $9001 are merged into one register (that would make sense because they use different data line.
* 4/4 of 7400 might be used for mirroring mux
* 3/4 of 7432 for OR-ing A14 with PRG-A14/15/16 for last bank.
* 1/4 of 7432 for ORing /ROMSEL and CPU-A14 to make the reg appear at $8000-$BFFF (?)

Note the unpopulated place for DIL14 chip.


Do you have back-side photo of this PCB?

User avatar
tiretrak
Posts: 11
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2020 11:29 am

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by tiretrak » Sat Oct 17, 2020 1:10 pm

krzysiobal wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 1:22 am
Do you have back-side photo of this PCB?
which pcb ?

krzysiobal
Posts: 785
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2011 12:06 pm
Location: Poland

Re: Help with Kaiser's Highway Star repro

Post by krzysiobal » Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:33 pm

tiretrak wrote:
Sat Oct 17, 2020 1:10 pm
krzysiobal wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 1:22 am
Do you have back-side photo of this PCB?
which pcb ?
Image

Post Reply