It is currently Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:41 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 44 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:11 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2014 4:35 pm
Posts: 3071
Location: Nacogdoches, Texas
+ rainwarrior


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:59 pm
Posts: 1391
koitsu wrote:
maybe this upcoming NES developer won't be doing NES development any longer

He isn't a developer, he was looking for one. But if a project leader gets discouraged by my little sarcasm, then he's not a real project leader to begin with and is probably just some kiddy that wants others to do his little game and nothing would have come out of this offer anyway.

koitsu wrote:
I'd like you to think about how this thread would have turned out had you just replied to the OP with something like this

The thread would have turned out differently, sure.

But you know how the thread also could have turned out differently? If the other people had concentrated on the original poster instead of starting a discussion with me and derailing the thread, i.e. doing exactly what they accused me to be doing.

As a standalone comment, my first post was neither derailment, nor a big discussion. I just told some guy who probably thinks programmers are a dime a dozen that he won't be successful if he just says: "I've got a project. Anybody wants to program for me?"

It was the fact that the others couldn't suppress their urge to argue with me that turned this, well, into an argument.


To all the Rainwarriors and mikejmoffitts on this forum:

Don't act all high and mighty.
Unfortunately, I don't find the threads anymore, but I remember a few threads where someone came here and offered a project and every single time the first reply was something like:
"You are the x-th person who wants to do this and nothing happened in the past, so we assume you're just like the others."
Did you condemn this as well?

Or when someone presented his "Mortal Kombat" demake:
viewtopic.php?f=22&t=11878

The second response that he got was:
Quote:
Not to put you down or anything, but I know for a fact you won't finish this game because it is simply too ambitious. Too much ambition will crush your working motive.


And none of you said anything about being too negative and discouraging the guy.

So, don't get on my fucking nerves just because I tell a wannabe project manager that people won't run to him just because he's talking about some generic NES game project that he has in mind, alright?

I could have been friendlier to him, but why should I? If I go to a car repair shop and say: "Hey guys, I've got an idea about some car stuff, but I won't tell you what it is. Come on, anybody wants to work with me?", I deserve being ridiculed.

Why should I treat lazy people who come here and basically say "Hey, yo, wanna do my game? Write me" with the highest respect?
And why do you act as if I had just insulted an established game designer who offered $ 20000 for programming work?
If someone asks a stupid question or makes a stupid offer, he gets a stupid answer from me. That's life. Deal with it!

It wouldn't have been blown out of proportion if you hadn't made this thread all about me by talking to me directly in every single one of your posts. If you had just answered the original poster, my post would have been forgotten soon.

_________________
Available now: My game "City Trouble".
Website: https://megacatstudios.com/products/city-trouble
Trailer: https://youtu.be/IYXpP59qSxA
Gameplay: https://youtu.be/Eee0yurkIW4
German Retro Gamer article: http://i67.tinypic.com/345o108.jpg


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:30 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2014 4:35 pm
Posts: 3071
Location: Nacogdoches, Texas
DRW wrote:
To all the Rainwarriors and mikejmoffitts on this forum:

Correction: To everyone else but me on this forum:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:41 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 8:55 am
Posts: 54
Location: Calgary.Alberta,Canada
I read some of these "I'm searching for a programmer,have idea"topics every week or two on other programming forums.They're almost always the same....no information and pm me for details"like it's a super secret :) "


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 3:46 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:59 pm
Posts: 1391
OmegaMax wrote:
I read some of these "I'm searching for a programmer,have idea"topics every week or two on other programming forums.They're almost always the same....no information and pm me for details"like it's a super secret :) "

^ This. Exactly this. :beer: :D

_________________
Available now: My game "City Trouble".
Website: https://megacatstudios.com/products/city-trouble
Trailer: https://youtu.be/IYXpP59qSxA
Gameplay: https://youtu.be/Eee0yurkIW4
German Retro Gamer article: http://i67.tinypic.com/345o108.jpg


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2008 1:17 am
Posts: 591
Lol - lil' drama thread. I get the feeling you can't let things go, DRW. Maybe a break from the forums would help. You seemed to get triggered by certain things, more often than some other members here. Or maybe, it's that you're just more blunt about it and it makes it stand out? I dunno. But either way, I don't particularly see it as scaring anyone else off. For the most part, this forum is pretty relaxed/chill.

Anyone who's been around many forums, should realize that you need to have developed some thick skin. And for the recorded, other than the escalation, I think I agree with your frustration ("I have the best idea ever for a game, I just need a programmer, artist, and musician to make the game for me. I'll be the director" <- ugh!). But I just ignore similar posts like that, or limit it to a snarky line or two response. Not worth the energy of getting worked up about it.

_________________
__________________________
http://pcedev.wordpress.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:25 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2016 8:55 am
Posts: 54
Location: Calgary.Alberta,Canada
tomaitheous wrote:
("I have the best idea ever for a game, I just need a programmer, artist, and musician to make the game for me. I'll be the director" <- ugh!).


:lol: Yeah those are really annoying


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:03 pm
Posts: 5709
Location: Canada
DRW wrote:
Unfortunately, I don't find the threads anymore, but I remember a few threads where someone came here and offered a project and every single time the first reply was something like:
"You are the x-th person who wants to do this and nothing happened in the past, so we assume you're just like the others."
Did you condemn this as well?

It's not good to reply this way, but no I probably wouldn't have addressed such a comment directly, unless maybe it seemed to be part of a pattern of behaviour from that person.

My beef here was specifically with your follow up, but also that this kind of follow up is your own pattern. It's about how much volume you regularly apply.

The example you gave also seems to be unaware of this difference:
DRW wrote:
OneCrudeDude two years ago wrote:
What you posted was a video of the GBC version, which does exist. I was expecting some footage of your hypothetical NES port, which instead I was greeted by some guy who can't stop talking.

Not to put you down or anything, but I know for a fact you won't finish this game because it is simply too ambitious. Too much ambition will crush your working motive.

And none of you said anything about being too negative and discouraging the guy.

OneCrudeDude also completely dropped this point after the reply, and engaged in quite polite discussion afterwards.

He didn't come back and have a 10 page argument about why he should have made that comment, he immediately moved on from it. That's what's different about what you're doing.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:34 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:03 pm
Posts: 5709
Location: Canada
OmegaMax wrote:
I read some of these "I'm searching for a programmer,have idea"topics every week or two on other programming forums.They're almost always the same....no information and pm me for details"like it's a super secret :) "

tomaitheous wrote:
("I have the best idea ever for a game, I just need a programmer, artist, and musician to make the game for me. I'll be the director" <- ugh!).

There's quite a big difference between someone like hawken offering paid work and people who think someone will be interested enough in their idea to work for free.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:45 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 07, 2013 2:59 pm
Posts: 1391
tomaitheous wrote:
Lol - lil' drama thread. I get the feeling you can't let things go, DRW.

I can. Have a look at the thread. After my original post, I did nothing but answer to posts that were specifically directed towards me. All of my posts were answers to posts that people spoke directly to me personally.
Not letting go would mean that people just ignore my statements, but I still come back again and again to the same thread to write more insulting things, despite nobody ever reacting to my previous posts.
But as long as people talk to me personally (not even about me, but towards me, like in: "DRW, don't be so rude" etc.), what does answering them have to do with not letting go?

tomaitheous wrote:
But I just ignore similar posts like that, or limit it to a snarky line or two response.

Exactly. Exactly. That's exactly what I did: I gave the original poster a snarky line and was done with it.

Just have a look: The whole discussion only started because people felt the urge to make a big fuss about my snarky one-liner. Had it not been for all the posts directed specifically towards me, I wouldn't have written anything else but my original post. All my other posts weren't even directed towards the thread creator anymore, but to the people who kept talking with me.

Like it happened just now again: Rainwarrior just had to write another reply, again directed specifically towards me:

rainwarrior wrote:
It's not good to reply this way, but no I probably wouldn't have addressed such a comment directly, unless maybe it seemed to be part of a pattern of behaviour from that person.

Well, it was always the same guy who always wrote the first reply to those kinds of threads.

rainwarrior wrote:
My beef here was specifically with your follow up, but also that this kind of follow up is your own pattern. It's about how much volume you regularly apply.

My volume is directly proportional to the volume you all apply addressing my posts directly.

rainwarrior wrote:
OneCrudeDude also completely dropped this point after the reply, and engaged in quite polite discussion afterwards.

He didn't come back and have a 10 page argument about why he should have made that comment, he immediately moved on from it.

Maybe that's because nobody accused him of being a dick in the first place. He made his statement and nobody criticised or even acknowledged it.

Do you think if nobody had commented on my original reply, I would have continued writing mean stuff?
You cannot answer this question for sure because you were never able to test this. Whenever I write some snarky comment, you just have to interfer and tell me what an asshole I am. It's like a compulsive act from your side.
You cannot just say to yourself: "Meh, this idiot again. Let's just ignore him."
No, you can't do this. You have to start an argument with me, you have to call me out every single time. And then you wonder why this turns into a discussion, not realizing that about one third or one fourth of the posts are your own.

Here's a hint: Next time I'm being sarcastic or, your favorite word, "rude", just don't react at all. Do you think your OCD allows you to do this? Because if you do, you'll see whether I come back and write a 10 page argument if nobody answered my first post.

rainwarrior wrote:
There's quite a big difference between someone like hawken offering paid work and people who think someone will be interested enough in their idea to work for free.

What the fuck are you talking about again? Where did he mention payment in his post?

_________________
Available now: My game "City Trouble".
Website: https://megacatstudios.com/products/city-trouble
Trailer: https://youtu.be/IYXpP59qSxA
Gameplay: https://youtu.be/Eee0yurkIW4
German Retro Gamer article: http://i67.tinypic.com/345o108.jpg


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:55 pm 
Offline
Formerly WheelInventor

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2016 2:55 am
Posts: 890
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Hawken's released a game on 3ds/wii u that looks and sounds good, and has a portfolio, so it's not like s/he's inexperienced with actually producing stuff. That's at least enough for me to have some faith, despite the original post not being very informative.

_________________
http://www.frankengraphics.com - personal NES blog


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 4:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:03 pm
Posts: 5709
Location: Canada
DRW wrote:
rainwarrior wrote:
There's quite a big difference between someone like hawken offering paid work and people who think someone will be interested enough in their idea to work for free.

What the fuck are you talking about again? Where did he mention payment in his post?

:roll:

"Freelance programming gig?"

1. freelance: noun: a person who works as a writer, designer, performer, or the like, selling work or services by the hour, day, job, etc., rather than working on a regular salary basis for one employer.
2. programming: noun: the sound a professional makes while eating crackers.
3. gig: noun: a single professional engagement, usually of short duration. / any job, especially one of short or uncertain duration.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Apr 13, 2008 11:12 am
Posts: 6273
Location: Seattle
DRW wrote:
just don't react at all. Do you think your OCD allows you to do this? Because if you do, you'll see whether I come back and write a 10 page argument if nobody answered my first post.
Why don't you take your own advice? Why do you think anyone wants to read your toxic snarking? Why are we obliged to let you stink up our community with your scorn and let it stand unchallenged?

I will state this plainly: You have never been thankful for the forum. You have never been helpful to any other person. You treat us like a bunch of underpaid research assistants at best. Indeed, you have never demonstrated any substantive positive emotion at all.

This forum would be strictly better off without you.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:11 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 9:28 pm
Posts: 3192
Location: Mountain View, CA, USA
DRW wrote:
koitsu wrote:
maybe this upcoming NES developer won't be doing NES development any longer

He isn't a developer, he was looking for one. But if a project leader gets discouraged by my little sarcasm, then he's not a real project leader to begin with and is probably just some kiddy that wants others to do his little game and nothing would have come out of this offer anyway.

If you think the problem is with the sarcasm, you are sadly mistaken (ask anyone who knows me: I'm a sarcastic son of a bitch, and very easily annoyed). The sarcasm isn't what I have a problem with -- it's something else. Something you disclose later on. Something worse.

DRW wrote:
koitsu wrote:
I'd like you to think about how this thread would have turned out had you just replied to the OP with something like this

The thread would have turned out differently, sure.

Good. So my question to you is then: why did you feel approach/mannerism you took was the appropriate way to express your displeasure? Are you unaware of how it discredits you, while simultaneously disheartening others? It does you no justice, and only makes you look bad. Ah, wait, you don't have to answer this -- because you already do here:

DRW wrote:
I could have been friendlier to him, but why should I? If I go to a car repair shop and say: "Hey guys, I've got an idea about some car stuff, but I won't tell you what it is. Come on, anybody wants to work with me?", I deserve being ridiculed.

And here we have it: it's not about sarcasm, it's about ridiculing someone else. You literally just admitted it. I'm not manipulating your words, or taking you out of context. And actually, admitting it is helpful because it means you're self-aware of your behaviour... though that does make me wonder why you thought feigning innocence through sarcasm would work? We're not idiots here, you know.

This is a very sour and awful trait you have. I hope at some point you unlearn it, or if not unlearn it, at least learn when and where to apply it (hint: NOT at a random person who approached showing humility and respect looking for NES developers. Save it for those rare opportunities, like "Okay, I've stayed quiet in this thread so far, but really I feel the need to say something" -- then let loose).

DRW wrote:
Why should I treat lazy people who come here and basically say "Hey, yo, wanna do my game? Write me" with the highest respect?

And why shouldn't you provide some common politeness (the same kind you'd show a stranger on the street -- someone you know nothing about, and who knows nothing about you)? I already gave you an example of how you could have approached the situation and expressed your displeasure, sternly at that, while simultaneously keeping that politeness. Again: "It would really help if you could at least post a synopsis of what your game is about and what it is you're looking for exactly (i.e. what the role of 'NES programmer' encompasses). People will likely be interested, but without any idea of what they could be getting involved with, I think many will avoid it. You can reach out to a bigger audience of potentials if you provide a summary of the game and list of needs/wants. Thanks!"

If you think that simple, commonplace politeness is showing "the highest respect", then I think your view of what "respect" amounts to is highly skewed.

DRW wrote:
It wouldn't have been blown out of proportion if you hadn't made this thread all about me by talking to me directly in every single one of your posts. If you had just answered the original poster, my post would have been forgotten soon.

I have to call bullshit on this as well. You have a track record of doing this. Repeatedly. It's a recurring behaviour, and therefore, your posts are really never "forgotten". Phrased differently: you are VERY difficult to ignore when you keep doing something that results in situations like this (yes, this whole discussion *IS* the result of your words/actions). And don't pull the ignorance card: you know exactly what I'm talking about. It's the same thing rainwarrior is talking about.

Actually, let's be crystal fucking clear here: You are responsible for your actions and words. If you go about mouthing off publicly, you should damn well expect someone to say something, or something to happen (to you/that affects you) as a result. You cannot blame others for your actions. A defense of "hey, just ignore me!" is really not a defense at all; it's a rebuttal I'd expect from a snotty-nosed 10 year old who is in dire need of a good ass-whooping.

Simply put, being a stern and "I don't cater to bullshit" type of person is perfectly fine (an old boss of mine described me in such a way that I still think is highly accurate: "he's very... prickly" (like a cactus)). What makes your behaviour awful is:

1. You have an established track record of doing this,
2. The person you responded to approached showing humility and politeness -- yet you ridiculed them (your words not mine),
3. You attempted to justify your actions through feigning sarcasm, followed by a strange "then just ignore me!" defense, while later admitting ridicule as your purpose.

The best I can determine is that you're simply annoyed seeing people show up and ask for NES programmers/developers (particularly without shedding light on what the project is about or what their needs of the developer are). And you know what, that's perfectly an OK thing to be annoyed with, and I doubt anyone here would have a problem with the fact that such annoys you (everybody is different/has different tolerances). If that's the case, then I liken this to Bregalad being annoyed by people showing up for no reason other than to try and make reproduction carts that they put on eBay to make money (i.e. people who know nothing, but want help, so they can try to make a quick buck). I understand his annoyance too, trust me! But you don't see him (at this point) ridiculing people over it, followed by multi-page diatribes with almost bizarre forms of reverse psychology being applied as a defense.

Otherwise, if you're completely inconsolable, and are destined to have the social graces of a gnat, then maybe this isn't the best place for you to be. There's a certain level of baseline respect that should be shown to people. Maybe you're from a different time, but in my day, this was part of what was called good netiquette. You violate many of these, and therein explains the annoyance of others. And again I remind you: I fully support someone's right to criticise and even offend, but how you're going about it isn't practical.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2016 5:22 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:57 pm
Posts: 1248
The issue I have here is that you've admitted to sometimes being blunt and coming off brashly, DRW, but you don't recognize that it's a problem. This entire thread is the result of everyone just ignoring when you do that (as you've suggested), and as you can see, simple ignorance doesn't solve anything, and in fact, reinforces the idea that the offending behavior is accepted.

As a lesson to all, if you have a problem with something, you need to voice your concerns as it happens, don't ignore it or else it just comes back up later as raw frustration that often seems like it comes out of nowhere.





































Also can everyone please chill out and stop typing giant essays as their replies? There's much more worthwhile things to be passionate about than one user's posting behavior.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 44 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Great Hierophant and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group