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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:59 pm 
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I played Zelda II before the first Zelda, so I was confused why Link had weapons like bombs, boomerangs and a bow in the Valiant comics that was running in the Swedish Nintendo magazine. The only long distance attack you have is the sword beam so, although it didn't really make sense, I thought for a while that those beams maybe was supposed to be arrows or something, like some kind of technical limitation that I didn't understand.

DRW wrote:
For a long time, I was under the assumption that Princess Daisy is Mario's love interest.
The reason: I only knew the "Super Mario Land" Game Boy games and the "Super Mario Bros. Super Show". And Mario and Princess Toadstool never had any romantic feelings for each other in the show. But in "Super Mario Land", you see a heart floating up when Mario rescues Princess Daisy.
Funnily, this assumption wouldn't even have changed if I had known the NES games. Because you won't find any romance between Mario and Princess Toadstool there either. Only with "Super Mario World" and "Super Mario All-Stars" was this made obvious in-game.
As a kid I thought it was pretty clear that Mario the hero gets the princess he saves in the end, despite the lack of floating hearts in the three NES games. Although I thought it was funny that he was hooking up with both Pauline and princess Daisy as well after saving them (and both produces a heart). As a Swede I (thankfully) wasn't exposed to the American Super Mario Super Show though.

FrankenGraphics wrote:
-My first encounter with Batman was Batman for the NES. I never saw the movie it was based on until maybe a decade later and never read any of the comics
What? Didn't you watch TV? The Batman TV-series was running on SVT, and it was great. I didn't watch the movie either until a decade later, so I thought the game was based on the TV-series.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:16 pm 
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Now that you mention it, i do remember the intro to the batman tv-series... but i can't recall seing an actual episode. :S

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:59 pm 
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Pokun wrote:
As a kid I thought it was pretty clear that Mario the hero gets the princess he saves in the end, despite the lack of floating hearts in the three NES games.

Unless Peach was already with someone and Mario was keeping the extraction mission strictly professional.

Pokun wrote:
Although I thought it was funny that he was hooking up with both Pauline and princess Daisy as well after saving them (and both produces a heart).

An episode of Game Theory conjectures that the character in the Donkey Kong arcade game is Mario's dad, also named Mario, though not everyone agrees.

Pokun wrote:
FrankenGraphics wrote:
-My first encounter with Batman was Batman for the NES. I never saw the movie it was based on until maybe a decade later and never read any of the comics

What? Didn't you watch TV? The Batman TV-series was running on SVT, and it was great. I didn't watch the movie either until a decade later, so I thought the game was based on the TV-series.

The 1966 series and 1989 film have very different tones.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 3:23 pm 
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tepples wrote:
An episode of Game Theory conjectures that the character in the Donkey Kong arcade game is Mario's dad, also named Mario, though not everyone agrees.

That theory is so fucking stupid. "Cranky Kong is Donkey Kong's grandfather, so Mario Jumpman is Super Mario's father. Duh!" No, he's not. Are we supposed to believe that the "Donkey Kong" Game Boy remake or those "Mario vs. Donkey Kong" games are starring today's Mario rescuing his mother Pauline?

By the way, am I the only one who thinks that Nintendo has totally fogotten about the whole "Cranky = the original Donkey Kong" plot?
It was definitely a thing when "Donkey Kong Country" came out. But today, it looks like this doesn't count anymore and that there's only supposed to be one Donkey Kong. (Well, and DK Junior.)
In the "Mario vs. Donkey Kong" games, it's clearly the modern Donkey Kong that has a crush on Pauline.
In that "Yoshi's Island" sequel, it's the modern Donkey Kong that is shown as a baby around the same age as Mario, Bowser and all the others.
And in "Donkey Kong Country Returns", was there ever any reference anymore that Cranky is the original Donkey Kong?

I think for the sake of simplicity, they merged the two Donkey Kongs into one person.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 4:07 pm 
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Always thought games only read controller input once per frame. Damn tool-assisted speedrunning!

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 6:04 pm 
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tepples wrote:
I seem to remember this picked up in April issues, as more of an April Fools' Day thing than a trap street thing.


In fact, some Japanese magazines did this every issue, which could be a problem for those not aware of this.

Okay. Just did a google and found this:
http://www.geocities.jp/omokurus2/usotech.html
At least Family Computer Magazine did this every.single.issue.

For your convenience, these are the Double Dragon and Upa ones. Coupling with convincing Photoshop fake screenshots didn't help.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 6:07 pm 
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Yeah those game theories are made to be funny rather than making sense. Nintendo knows that Cranky Kong is supposed to be the original Donkey Kong and Super Donkey is a grown up Donkey Kong Jr. But it was Rare that made up that part, and although they allowed it, I think Nintendo aren't sure if they want to canonize it.

FrankenGraphics wrote:
Now that you mention it, i do remember the intro to the batman tv-series... but i can't recall seing an actual episode. :S
I see, you had seen it but just forgotten it. As I couldn't read yet I also didn't understood much about the plot, unless my parents read the subtitles aloud for me. But I liked the opening, the fight scenes "SMACK! POW!" and the scenes when Batman and Robin climbed a wall (shown by turning the camera on the side).

tepples wrote:
Pokun wrote:
As a kid I thought it was pretty clear that Mario the hero gets the princess he saves in the end, despite the lack of floating hearts in the three NES games.

Unless Peach was already with someone and Mario was keeping the extraction mission strictly professional.
You are defying common fiction logic!

tepples wrote:
Pokun wrote:
FrankenGraphics wrote:
-My first encounter with Batman was Batman for the NES. I never saw the movie it was based on until maybe a decade later and never read any of the comics

What? Didn't you watch TV? The Batman TV-series was running on SVT, and it was great. I didn't watch the movie either until a decade later, so I thought the game was based on the TV-series.
The 1966 series and 1989 film have very different tones.
I was talking about my own misconception. As I only knew of the TV series as a kid I probably thought the game (that came out about during the same time as the TV-series was airing in Sweden) was based on that. I'm not sure I was aware of the comics either.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:42 am 
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Pokun wrote:
Yeah those game theories are made to be funny rather than making sense.

I fail to realize what's so funny about it, like in "Ha ha! Yeah, that one is good."
James Bond being a time lord, hence his different actors, might be a funny theory that's clearly not meant to be taken serious.
But to me, it sounds more like those game theories are actual theories that someone believes. If it's supposed to be a joke, I fail to find the punchline. Especially since there are so many morons out there that seriously quote that shit: "Those are two Marios. Game Theory confirmed it."

Pokun wrote:
Nintendo knows that Cranky Kong is supposed to be the original Donkey Kong and Super Donkey is a grown up Donkey Kong Jr.

Who is Super Donkey? If you mean Donkey Kong from "Donkey Kong Country": That guy is actually supposed to be either the son or the nephew of Donkey Kong Jr. since Cranky Kong is his grandfather.
(The Nintendo 64 game called him his father, as far as I know, but all the other games before and after used grandfather.)

Pokun wrote:
But it was Rare that made up that part, and although they allowed it, I think Nintendo aren't sure if they want to canonize it.

I assume they retconned it. In today's time, the Donkey Kong with the tie is always presented as the only Donkey Kong and as Mario's rival.

So, basically, it looks like this is the current canon stance on the matter:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYs084fNLL4

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:38 am 
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I think Game Theories are obviously made to entertain, even if you don't appreciate their humour, neither do I. Maybe some of them are more plausible than others but I wouldn't take any of them seriously, that's just being silly.


By Super Donkey I obviously meant the hero of Donkey Kong Country, I wanted one short phrase to refer him as in my argument. :) Super matches with Mario vs Super Mario (plus Donkey Kong Country is also known as Super Donkey Kong of course, as it's the Super NES instalment of the series).

I used to believe Super Donkey is the son of DK Jr, but I remember reading that a Rare employee saying that he had designed Super Donkey with the intention of him being a grown up Jr. I read through my DKC manual for mentions of Cranky being his grandfather but I couldn't find any, so I assumed it's possible Cranky is his father. Cranky is also often referred to Grandfather Kong, but I assume that is just refers to his social status rather than blood relation status to Super Donkey.
Hmm it seems Rare themselves was confused or changed their mind. Check out this wiki entry. Also Diddy was first supposed to be DK Jr at first, but Nintendo wouldn't allow a complete redesign so they had to make him an original character.

Yeah Nintendo either mistook Rare's intentions or just ignored them, and acts like there is only one Donkey Kong nowdays. But they use the design of Super Donkey and also Donkey Kong Jr is nowhere to be seen (with the exception of Donkey Kong '98 and Mario Tennis 64), maybe as a way to avoid the problem.
Personally I was never a fan of Rare replacing the original Donkey Kong with a new one, so I'm fine with Nintendo not canonizing it.

Also people like Miyamoto likes to stick in a story in their games, but isn't very serious about having it make sense and tie together previous games. Remember, Mario was originally Donkey Kong's abusive owner, and Donkey Kong kidnapped his girlfriend sometimes to get back at him, only to later release her again because he wasn't really a bad guy.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 5:15 am 
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The first time I played a Megaman game, I supposed the character select screen I was in was to select the guy I was going to play with, not the boss stage.
I discovered it after I arrived at the boss battle room...
Kind of dumb misconception. :mrgreen:

I also would like to know the history of the Dragon Fighter when I was younger.
Back in the day, after finishing the game, a friend of mine tought of a theory that this game's main character was in fact Shiryu, from the Saint Seiya anime that was popular here.
Just another nonsense theory that kind of made sense back them. :oops:


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 5:39 am 
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Fisher wrote:
I also would like to know the history of the Dragon Fighter when I was younger.
Back in the day, after finishing the game, a friend of mine tought of a theory that this game's main character was in fact Shiryu, from the Saint Seiya anime that was popular here.

I didn't know this game back in the day, but nobody can deny the resemblance:

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Attachment:
shiryu.jpg
shiryu.jpg [ 100.15 KiB | Viewed 648 times ]

The long hair, green armor, dragon-shaped helmet, pointy skirt... I wouldn't be surprised if this was more than a coincidence.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:08 am 
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Pokun wrote:
I remember reading that a Rare employee saying that he had designed Super Donkey with the intention of him being a grown up Jr.
[...]
Also Diddy was first supposed to be DK Jr at first, but Nintendo wouldn't allow a complete redesign so they had to make him an original character.

That's what I always find so suspicious with these rumors:
On the one hand, Donkey Kong was designed to be a grown-up Junior.
On the other hand, Diddy was supposed to be Junior.

So, what now? Did they intend the game to star a grown-up Donkey Kong Junior being accompanied by a cloned child version of himself? Or does "was originally intended" simply mean: "We thought about it for five minutes and then abolished the idea immediately"?

Pokun wrote:
I read through my DKC manual for mentions of Cranky being his grandfather but I couldn't find any, so I assumed it's possible Cranky is his father.

From the game:
"It's about time you visited your frail, old Grandpa!"
"And what have you brought for your old Grandpa?"
"Well, you've amazed your old Grandpa by getting this far!"
"So, you've finally come to get some game play advice from your old Grandpa!"

This also makes much more sense: Donkey Kong Jr. was the hero of his own old-school game, even rescuing the old Donkey Kong/Cranky. So it doesn't make much sense for Cranky to always complain to him that the new games are crap and that the new Donkey Kong wouldn't last in those games. This fits much better for the grandson who was never in an old-school game.

About whether Nintendo retconned it to be a single Donkey Kong: I wasn't aware of the references in the baseball and the "Brawl" game, so maybe I was wrong with my assumption. Or maybe they just don't care.


Here's another misconception that I once had:

I thought that the "Donkey Kong" Game Boy game intends to show the modern Donkey Kong. After all, he wears a tie and has a pointed head, not a round one.
So, I saw that game as a sequel where the new Donkey Kong kidnaps Pauline, just like his grandfather did.
In the ending sequence, Mario and Donkey Kong make peace with each other, so that was my explanation why he's a hero in the next game, "Donkey Kong Country".

Since Donkey Kong Junior appears in the game as well, I assumed that there are four Donkey Kongs:
The arcade one which is Cranky Kong.
Arcade Donkey Kong Junior.
Donkey Kong from "Donkey Kong Country" and from the Game Boy game.
And that one's son Donkey Kong Junior from the Game Boy game.

But today, it's obvious to me that the Game Boy game is just supposed to be an enhanced retelling of the arcade game, even though the Donkey Kong from the Game Boy game also wears a tie.

What I don't understand: Which game is canon now? "Donkey Kong" for the arcade or "Donkey Kong" for the Game Boy? If it's the Game Boy version, does that mean that "Donkey Kong Jr." never happened? The idea of Mario putting Donkey Kong into a cage doesn't fit with the Game Boy game's storyline.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:40 am 
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Sure Tokumaru!
Maybe there was some influence on the artist and/or art style.
Or even the artist could be inspired by the anime, since the Famicon's boxart looks like Seiya with a dragon armor and a sword.
I didn't know that at the time.
Attachment:
dragon-fighter.jpeg
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Attachment:
tumblr_mbp4lwZGYu1qcqxrb.jpg
tumblr_mbp4lwZGYu1qcqxrb.jpg [ 62.67 KiB | Viewed 624 times ]

The teory was very crazy!!
He tought many details of a side story that Shiryu borrowed the Libra's sword to fight the evil sorcerer.
With this, he learned the ability to transform into a dragon.
I need to find this friend... he tought of many details of a supposed side history.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:52 am 
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Yeah, and Journey to Silius is supposed to be a Terminator game, and Outlander is supposed to be a Mad Max game. Could the Saint Seiya license have likewise been yanked late in development?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:10 am 
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Good point!
Any known people involved on this game that could speak about it?
I know Bandai made 2 games for the Famicom back in the day.
I think it was around 1987/88, when the franchise were new at Japan, I suppose.


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