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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:49 am 
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Hello! This is my first post to the site and I have created a Discord Server for Programmers, Artists, and Musicians to come together to create NES software.

https://discord.gg/pTWwBCp


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:50 pm 
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In this Tweet, dougeff wrote:
what are people using discord for? I imagine its just a more annoying IRC chat, since people will be talking over each other.

Slack and Discord fit in a space somewhere between IRC and a forum. Here are some features that Discord has and IRC lacks:

  • The server automatically logs text channels. A user can view messages sent to a channel while the user was offline without each user having to obtain a shell account on which to run ZNC.
  • Membership in a set of related text and voice channels is grouped, and the owner of such a group can sync permissions throughout the group by assigning roles to members.
  • Users can upload attachments to the server, and the client embeds previews of attachments and linked websites. Unlike with DCC, no port forwarding is required.
  • Users can add emojis as reactions to a message, and it counts how many users have added each reaction to a message.

What IRC server and client extensions would allow all of the above?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 11:24 pm 
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Hello, welcome to the forums.

I personally am not interested in participating in a Discord chat, but in case the goal was just that you wished there was a live chatroom to talk about NESDev stuff, I would recommend #NESDev on EFNet IRC.

Otherwise, just stick around and post on the forums! This is a relatively small community, and not a lot of people are online at any given time. Forum posts cast a much wider net for discussion than live chat, even though it's a slow way to communicate.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:53 am 
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The complaint, as I understand it, is that #nesdev on EFnet routinely goes so far off-topic that its character has become overly hardware-oriented to the exclusion of software development. People talk more about "the new FPGA console I'm working on" than about making NES games.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 8:25 am 
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^
I'm sad to hear people feel this way. However while there is a lot of hardware talk going on, I never felt like software talk specifically was discouraged. Thing is, people have to bring it up if they want to talk about it!


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:51 am 
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I happen to prefer IRC is better protocol, rather than Discord.
tepples wrote:
Here are some features that Discord has and IRC lacks:

  • The server automatically logs text channels. A user can view messages sent to a channel while the user was offline without each user having to obtain a shell account on which to run ZNC.
  • Membership in a set of related text and voice channels is grouped, and the owner of such a group can sync permissions throughout the group by assigning roles to members.
  • Users can upload attachments to the server, and the client embeds previews of attachments and linked websites. Unlike with DCC, no port forwarding is required.
  • Users can add emojis as reactions to a message, and it counts how many users have added each reaction to a message.

What IRC server and client extensions would allow all of the above?
All of this can certainly be done in a IRC server:
  • I have once modified an existing IRC server software to do auto logging, although normally it is another client that does that I think; at least the #esoteric in Freenode uses another client to log.
  • Many IRC servers implement a CS command; try CS HELP for a description of the commands and how to use them in that server. Freenode has the following: "Available exttargets are: $chanacs:#channel - Any user with channel access in the given channel (including hostmasks)." It also has "extended bans (ban conditionals)", listed by HELP EXTBAN.
  • I have seen no IRC with attachment uploads, although I have seen attachments uploaded to Discord servers and posted on IRC. However, it can be implemented (a client extension will be needed too in this case).
  • Such "message reactions" I don't really see much point, although I suppose an IRC server could provide a mode that if the user activates it will provide a serial number with each message, enabling to do such thing.
There are other features of IRC too that are not commonly implemented though:
  • Modeless channels: Channel names with + at front, with no permissions, modes cannot be set, and channel takeovers are impossible (because setting yourself as an operator and banning other users is impossible).
  • Other kind of channels: Channel names with & at front (local to one server), and with ! at front ("safe", but otherwise like the common # channels). Both are also immune to takeovers, but for different reasons; they do have modes, unlike + channels.
  • The SUMMON command: If a user is on the server, the IRC can be used to call them to the IRC without the user having to be on the IRC all the time.

tepples wrote:
The complaint, as I understand it, is that #nesdev on EFnet routinely goes so far off-topic that its character has become overly hardware-oriented to the exclusion of software development. People talk more about "the new FPGA console I'm working on" than about making NES games.
While this happens (and off-topic is not always about that either), I think, if you have something to write about making NES games (a question, a comment about the game you make, etc), then please to mention it. You will write about off-topic when you do not have a on-topic to mention, but when you do, then you can discuss the on-topics (and if someone is simultaneously discussing something else, those who are engaged in the on-topic conversation can ignore them if it isn't relevant to their discussion). (I personally have both on-topic and off-topic things to discuss on this IRC.)

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:43 pm 
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tepples wrote:
The complaint, as I understand it, is that #nesdev on EFnet routinely goes so far off-topic that its character has become overly hardware-oriented to the exclusion of software development. People talk more about "the new FPGA console I'm working on" than about making NES games.

What complaint are you referring to? Nobody complained in this thread about #NESDev as far as I can see? O_o

Like, if you want to start an argument about Discord vs IRC, that's fine I guess, but the OP gave me no reason to assume the proposal was Discord or death. I just assumed they were looking for a place to chat? (Why did you link my twitter conversation with dougeff out of context?)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:13 pm 
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Quote:
Why did you link my twitter conversation with dougeff out of context?


I feel it's "in context". We are all talking about discord. My question on Twitter was not unrelated to chatting with people about nesdev. (Which I'm still not sure if people are doing on discord.)

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:58 pm 
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rainwarrior wrote:
tepples wrote:
The complaint, as I understand it, is that #nesdev on EFnet routinely goes so far off-topic that its character has become overly hardware-oriented to the exclusion of software development. People talk more about "the new FPGA console I'm working on" than about making NES games.

What complaint are you referring to? Nobody complained in this thread about #NESDev as far as I can see? O_o

I've complained about it before (outside of the forums), but most of the time I just take my game design discussions to dedicated game development places, and/or show off progress on Twitter. I usually feel like the odd one out though in a room where everyone else is using Unity/Unreal, but it does make your own project stand out a bit.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 2:36 pm 
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dougeff wrote:
Quote:
Why did you link my twitter conversation with dougeff out of context?

I feel it's "in context". We are all talking about discord. My question on Twitter was not unrelated to chatting with people about nesdev. (Which I'm still not sure if people are doing on discord.)

Well I felt taken out of context. On twitter I was not talking about NESDev or this particular Discord suggestion.

I said here I'm not interested in joining an NESDev Discord channel, but the reason is entirely that this need is already being met by #NESDev.

I do have (many) complaints about Discord but they're unrelated-- I am certainly willing to (and do) use Discord for chat channels that were already established there. There are differences between Discord and IRC, and I do prefer the latter, but they're both serviceable chat methods.


I'd much rather see #NESDev improved with new faces than have a new conversation fragment start up in some other corner. I would grant that it's a relatively quiet place where people sometimes have off-topic conversations (why not, though?), but every time someone brings up actual relevant NESDev stuff the conversation does get going, and switches to that pretty quick.


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