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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:43 am 
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It's a given fact. I don't fiddle around with my original console. That's not up for discussion.

Fiddling around with external stuff, like those converters, is fine, but my console stays in its original form.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:47 am 
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Considered getting an AV Famicom then? You get all the bonuses of a top loader, no region protection, AND built-in composite output (the best you can get from an NES without "fiddling around"). You'd just need a converter the other way around to play your NES titles on it.

Personally I'm a huge fan of my US top loader, I'd never go back to using the front loader. Such a huge and clunky design, a crappy connector, and generally such a hassle to use.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:00 am 
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No, I don't want to aquire a whole new console just to play "F-1 Race".

All I want is a converter in a shell for the console that I've been using for years now.
If I don't find one, I will somehow saw a shell in half and use my authentic Gyromite converter, but if I can find an all-in-one piece (or a converter with a CIC and without a shell that fits into another non-CIC-converter's shell), I will prefer this one.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:28 am 
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DRW wrote:
It's a given fact. I don't fiddle around with my original console. That's not up for discussion.

Fiddling around with external stuff, like those converters, is fine, but my console stays in its original form.
I was answering to Sumez. Why disable the CIC in the console and decrease compatibility when the CIC is trivial to make in an adapter.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:56 am 
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Oh, o.k.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:14 am 
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Pokun wrote:
Why disable the CIC in the console and decrease compatibility when the CIC is trivial to make in an adapter.

How does disabling the CIC decrease compatibility? Which game won't play without it?


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:20 am 
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Some famous competition cartridge I think.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:21 am 
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Sumez wrote:
How does disabling the CIC decrease compatibility? Which game won't play without it?

As far as I know, only the extremely rare Nintendo World Championship cart relies on the CIC. However, on the SNES, many games with extra chips requires a CIC.

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Well as the CIC is trivial to make with a microcontroller

It might be relatively simple, but definitely NOT trivial - as anything microcontroller related is very unlikely to be trivial, period. You should look it up before talking. Soldering a wire or cutting a track is trivial. Picking a microcontroller, programming it, be sure that the frequency is OK, and the pinout too, etc... is far from trivial.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:36 am 
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Bregalad wrote:
As far as I know, only the extremely rare Nintendo World Championship cart relies on the CIC.

Haha, okay. I feel that's a very vague argument to not mod your NES then :P Unless you just happen to have a NWC cartridge lying around and really want to play it for some reason.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:38 am 
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Sumez wrote:
How does disabling the CIC decrease compatibility? Which game won't play without it?


The real Nintendo World Championships 1990 cartridges require the CIC reset pin. However, the "requirement" may be just to restart the timer upon pressing reset. A single play of the cartridge should work OK from what I have read, so you can do a power cycle to obtain the same effect as a reset. The far rarer Nintendo Campus Challenge 1991 cartridge may also require the CIC reset pin.

Similarly, the PAL Super Mario Bros. + Tetris + Nintendo World Cup requires the CIC reset pin to reset to the game select menu. I believe that if the CIC reset is not present, you can only reset to the game. Again, a power cycle will have the same effect on a CIC-less system.

The Blinking Light Win includes a CIClone to interact with the console's CIC but still passes the reset through to the cartridges, so these carts work properly.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:36 am 
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Sumez wrote:
Haha, okay. I feel that's a very vague argument to not mod your NES then :P Unless you just happen to have a NWC cartridge lying around and really want to play it for some reason.

Well, he said N times he does not want to cut the pin 4 of his CIC, and wants to keep this system as it was originally sold. This is enough for a reason, he does not need any further reason.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 10:10 am 
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I can completely respect that, I was talking about the other argument, that it "decreases compatibility". I honestly don't think that should factor into anyone's descisions. I normally only use my top loader, which doesn't even have a CIC. I'd assume it has the same, heh, "problem".

If you have a PAL NES especially, you definitely don't want a CIC. Nintendo were annoying enough to split Europe into two different CIC regions, which means you'd most likely end up with at least three different regions of cartridges within a few days of collecting NES games in Europe :P


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 1:41 pm 
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Sumez wrote:
If you have a PAL NES especially, you definitely don't want a CIC. Nintendo were annoying enough to split Europe into two different CIC regions, which means you'd most likely end up with at least three different regions of cartridges within a few days of collecting NES games in Europe :P

Well I've yet to have seen any PAL-A game in real-life, period. Games seems to remain mostly domestic.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 1:51 pm 
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Sumez wrote:
I can completely respect that, I was talking about the other argument, that it "decreases compatibility".

LOL the entire intended function of the CIC is to decrease compatibility. ;)

Anyhow, sure if you're uncomfortable with "jailbreaking" your NES with a little snip, there's the other way to get around the problem, just more expensive and less convenient.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:03 pm 
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I've carried out 5 snips so far. Seeing the european market got split into two compability regions which now is in the way for 2nd hand trade and all the ntsc carts that are flooding europe, i expect i'll get a couple more house calls. Uncut/undesoldered/unpatched PAL neses might someday become a rarity.

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