Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

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infiniteneslives
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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by infiniteneslives » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:01 pm

My "distaste" for your cases was already settled by the agreement that I send you another shell. I don't know why you bring this up again.
I don't see it as settled because the reason you don't like my cases are that they bend. My point is any case will bend significantly when sliced in half.

I the discussion was pretty simple from my perspective..

INL: I have cases but they aren't very proper.
DRW: Can you cut an original case for me instead?
INL: No, cutting original cases it's against my religion.
DRW: It's just that your cases are too bendy, what about if I sent you a non-original case instead?
INL: Sure, cutting another manufactures (non-original) case isn't against my religion. I reluctantly accept provided the timing is convenient for me (next summer). I still don't think you'll like it because it will bend a lot due to lack of structural strength.
DRW: So, are you telling me that you won't be able to create a proper device until summer?
INL: Regardless of when I cut it any sawed case will be bendy, which is what you don't like. I still have no confidence I can create you a proper case.
DRW: I thought we settled the bendy issue, why are you bringing it up.
INL: (this post)
DRW wrote:Would it be possible to buy some cheap converter from eBay and you put yours into its casing?
I doubt it, but you're free to try I guess..?
The actual issue is that you later said you won't be able to use your good saw for a few more months and that you're not sure how you will implement a strap for pulling the converter out of the console.
This is a completely separate issue that needs to be cleared first and it has nothing to do with which shell you use, does it?
I have items on hand to solve this today, I just haven't taken the time to do it. Part of my delay on the converter is I'm still waiting on my expansion port audio boards which I would like to release at the same time.

I thought offering you early access to one of my products might be helpful. I no longer feel like me providing you early access to my product will be a pleasurable experience for you. It won't be early access anyway since I can't saw your case to the best of my ability for several more months. Sorry if I lead you on, I don't think I can help you very much.

If you want a good CIC, and proper case, I still recommend stoneagegamer's converters. I'm pretty sure they have a good CIC solution. I'm fairly certain they don't support 4screen mirroring, but it's unlikely you have famicom carts which would be affected. I'm also fairly certain they don't properly mix expansion audio, nor send audio to EXP6 pin to support the resistor audio mod. These things could all be confirmed by with an image of the PCB top/bottom.

I'm hoping to release everything on my site by January. If you'd like to reach out to me in June have me saw your case in half that's fine. I don't like saying this, but offer any guarantee of satisfaction, and it would be completely at your risk. Me cutting your case would have to be seen as a favor between friends, not a business transaction. Possible I could accidentally completely destroy your one case while attempting to cut it, that's a risk you would have to accept.
If you're gonna play the Game Boy, you gotta learn to play it right. -Kenny Rogers

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Fisher
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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by Fisher » Sun Nov 19, 2017 3:51 pm

infiniteneslives wrote: No, cutting original cases it's against my religion.
LOL to that!! :lol:

By the way, can you do the exact opposite, an adapter to play NES games on Famicom?
I found some near me but they're very expensive!! :cry:

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by infiniteneslives » Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:21 pm

By the way, can you do the exact opposite, an adapter to play NES games on Famicom?
I found some near me but they're very expensive!! :cry:
I've gotten a rather large number of requests for this since I announced my FC->NES project. Safe to say I will make NES->FC time permitting. I have even fewer options for famicom shells that could be turned into enclosures however. I do have famicom cases, but due to their snapping together I don't expect they would work well having the top half sawed off. A pair of acrylic pieces with standoffs and PCB sandwiched between might actually work well enough. The overall form is less demanding for the famicom due to the connector not being buried deep inside the console like the frontloading NES.
If you're gonna play the Game Boy, you gotta learn to play it right. -Kenny Rogers

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by Bregalad » Mon Nov 20, 2017 12:30 am

Pokun wrote:It's not about the lockout chip, it's about the CIRAM /CE pin as Infiniteneslives explained. Many converters just bridge it with another pin so that you can't remap VRAM to the cartridge. This breaks any game that need those pins for 4-screen or such. MMC5 games, Rad Racer II, Gauntlet etc will not work properly in that case.
This sound extremely easy to fix by cutting a few traces and adding a few wires, though.

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by Pokun » Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:37 am

Yes that's what you have to do with most adapters. The expansion audio also needs a mod. If someone makes a newly produced adapter that passes all pins properly and also has a region free CIC clone, I'd rather take that though.
Bregalad wrote:You can use converters inside one of ROB's game (Gyromite and... ? I don't remember the second title), but they come without a proper case so it's not very great to use them.
Stackup, that game become very rare in North America because, unlike Gyromite, there's a 100% chance it contains a Famicom cartridge board with adapter, and people got overboard and hunted it almost to extinction. This is the reason why cannibalizing is bad, it's better to use newly produced adapters.

Gyromite is the better game of the two though, but that's beside the point.

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by nesrocks » Mon Nov 20, 2017 6:54 am

Has this been brought up on this discussion? I thought it was interesting. It doesn't have a 60 pin connector in itself, but it claims to be region free, so any 72-60 adapter should be enough to go along with it.

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by rainwarrior » Mon Nov 20, 2017 12:48 pm

The BLW is "region free" because it fits the PAL NES board just as well as the North American NES. It doesn't have anything to do with the CIC.

...though disabling the CIC is pretty trivial while you're already in there installing the BLW.

Edit: I was wrong about this, it actually even has an onboard CIC.

One thing it does help with a little is that you get rid of that stupid pop-down caddy when you install it, so there's more space for a Famicom cartridge + adapter to fit inside. I found that silver bar across the top didn't leave enough room to fit many Famicom carts with the gyromite adapter; either I had to open the cartridge and use the bare board, or just take apart my NES to remove the caddy when I wanted to use it.
Last edited by rainwarrior on Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by nesrocks » Mon Nov 20, 2017 12:57 pm

rainwarrior wrote:The BLW is "region free" because it fits the PAL NES board just as well as the North American NES. It doesn't have anything to do with the CIC.
It totally says in the video that it turns the NES into a region free system. Is the guy in the video confused? If it's untrue it may lead people to making an uninformed purchase.
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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by rainwarrior » Mon Nov 20, 2017 1:18 pm

Oh, you know what, I'm wrong! I didn't know it even had that. Okay, so it has its own CIC clone onboard.

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by Pokun » Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:41 pm

Heh I didn't know that either. So installing a BLW makes it region free as far as 72 pin goes. That's better than disabling the CIC (for the few games that requires it). No soldering required either, I'll consider this if I get a NES again one day.

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by DRW » Sun Dec 03, 2017 4:30 am

@infiniteneslives:

I bought that converter from Stoneagegamer and guess what: It's a piece of crap.

When I try to use it, the title screen is shown for a moment, then the NES goes into perpetual reset mode, i.e. exactly the thing that it does when it doesn't detect a correct CIC.

Since the converter has the Stoneagegamer logo on the front, I thought this is a converter by the homebrew community. But when I opened up the case, I found out that this is just a stupid Honeybee converter.
Also, there's no chip whatsoever in the place where the CIC would be located.

So, yeah, it might be good enough for a top loader or some clone console. But the Stoneagegamer converter will not work with an unmodified front loader NES. It's just a cheap Chinese product.
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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by DRW » Sun Dec 03, 2017 5:52 am

So, I'm still looking for a proper Famicom-to-NES converter that can be used with a regular NTSC NES.

Isn't there anything that can be ordered that isn't shitty Chinese crap?
Today, you can buy bare NES boards and complete homebrew games that all have a proper CIC inside, but there's no Famicom converter that uses this technique yet?
Available now: My game "City Trouble".
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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by tokumaru » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:57 am

It looks like krikzz has a decent adapter: https://krikzz.com/store/home/40-famico ... apter.html

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by DRW » Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:07 am

This one doesn't have a shell. Which is the reason why I don't want to use the original Nintendo converter anymore. Because it fails more than it works thanks to putting the bare bones board into the slot.
Available now: My game "City Trouble".
Sales website: https://megacatstudios.com/products/city-trouble
Gameplay: https://youtu.be/Eee0yurkIW4
Download website: http://www.denny-r-walter.de/city.htm

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Re: Ways to play Famicom games on an NES

Post by DRW » Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:51 am

Does anybody know what lockout circumvention method the converter by Krikzz uses?

I wrote them two messages, but their answer was basically:
"We don't know. The converter was not created with the intention to play Famicom games on an NES, but to use the Famicom version of the Everdrive in NES consoles."

So, obviously, the guy answering the messages is not a technician, otherwise he should know that it doesn't matter what cartridge you play on this converter. The lockout defeat mechanism still has to come from the converter itself.
Available now: My game "City Trouble".
Sales website: https://megacatstudios.com/products/city-trouble
Gameplay: https://youtu.be/Eee0yurkIW4
Download website: http://www.denny-r-walter.de/city.htm

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