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PostPosted: Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:29 am 
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tokumaru wrote:
That's one thing I could never understand... My mother-in-law used to love those frenetic little games where you work in a restaurant and have to make food and serve people. I tried it a couple of times and found it stressful as hell! I can't imagine why people would choose to experience the stress of work during their free time!

Because it's a game, there's less issues if you do something wrong. Typically for driving or flying, you'll be very happy that you only did an accident in your simulation and not in real life !


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 7:02 am 
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For me, I have no problems with FPS games in general, but I can see why a lot of people hate it.
The first FPS I can imagine was probably Unreal Tournament 2004, or one of the MoH games, and I remember having a fun time with those.

I have absolutely no interest in JRPGs regardless if it is retro or modern, strategy games (with the exeption of Age Of Empires 2 - The Old Edition, becuase HD just failed to work for me, and I kinda like the NES port of Overlord too), and considering the fact that almost every single game that used expansion audio in Famicom titles are either RPGs or weird text-adventure games.... :S

I also don't like sports games. You do sports outside, not inside. :P

Not to mention that I saw in a GoodNES set about 500+ hacks of online Tecmo Bowl hacks outta there and I was like:
*why is this exist...*

I also hate *insert random thing here* - simulator games which are mostly joke subject nowadays.
My favourite genre is platformers. My favourite game series is Adventure Island.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 7:19 am 
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MrNorbert1994 wrote:
and considering the fact that almost every single game that used expansion audio in Famicom titles are either RPGs or weird text-adventure games.... :S

You're learning me that Castlevania III and Gimmick are either RPGs or weird text-adventure games.

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I also hate *insert random thing here* - simulator games which are mostly joke subject nowadays.

I find them rather funny myself, especially those infamous ones with a lot of glitches - although if I bought them I understand I'd feel scammed.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 7:34 am 
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Not to mention that I saw in a GoodNES set about 500+ hacks of online Tecmo Bowl hacks outta there and I was like:
*why is this exist...*


My first toedip into nes hobbyism was a romhack of Volleyball to be set it in Poland, 1955 - based on a photo i saw once and that students from around the world would gather at so called youth for peace conferences and youth festivals, of which one was held in Warsaw 1955.

I think it's the same reason you'd hack any team sports game - you want to update, vary or customize the teams, nations or rosters

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:33 am 
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Bregalad wrote:
You're learning me that Castlevania III and Gimmick are either RPGs or weird text-adventure games.


Obviously those are exeptions, but games like Megami Tensei II or Metal Slader Glory are kind of in the unplayable area for me at the moment. :P
I wish if they would have included Erika To Satoru's soundtrack in a game like Xexyz - hence same developer. :P
At least we have Mappy Kids for that matter.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:34 am 
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MrNorbert1994 wrote:
I also hate *insert random thing here* - simulator games which are mostly joke subject nowadays.

I know what you're talking about with respect to things like Goat Simulator. But are you including SimCity ("City Simulator") and Spore ("Intelligent Design Simulator")?

Bregalad wrote:
MrNorbert1994 wrote:
almost every single game that used expansion audio in Famicom titles are either RPGs or weird text-adventure games.... :S

You're learning me that Castlevania III and Gimmick are either RPGs or weird text-adventure games.

Those are the few exceptions. Let me look through FamiTracker's expansion select:

  • VRC audio games other than CV3: Mouryou Senki Madara, Esper Dream 2, and Lagrange Point are RPGs.
  • Sunsoft 5B: Gimmick is a platformer.
  • MMC5
    Non-RPGs: Gunsight (called Laser Invasion elsewhere) is not, as it's a Zapper game.
    Simulator of traditional tabletop game: Shin 4 Nin Uchi Mahjong is Eastern rummy and thankfully had enough ROM to make the 人 (person) kanji on the title screen not look like a dildo.
    RPG, strategy, or graphical adventure: Just Breed is a tactical RPG. Metal Slader Glory is a graphical adventure, which I assume MrNorbert1994 meant by "weird text-adventure games". Literally everything else is a Koei war sim.
    Audio use: Just Breed uses audio, but I don't know which others do and don't.
  • Namco 163: I'm least familiar with this catalog. I ran down the Namco 163 list on NesCartDB and searched the web for their genre, but I'll let others fill in their audio use.
    Sports: Famista '90 (aka RBI Baseball), Final Lap (racing; sequel to Pole Position II), Namco Classic (golf), Namco Classic II (golf)
    Other non-RPGs: Dragon Ninja (a beat-em-up called Bad Dudes elsewhere), Mappy Kids (platformer), Rolling Thunder (side-scrolling action, also released by Tengen), Youkai Douchuuki (platformer)
    RPG, strategy, or graphical adventure: Battle Fleet (strategy), Dokuganryuu Masamune (war sim), Erika to Satoru no Yume Bouken (graphical adventure), Hydlide 3: Yami Kara no Houmonsha (action RPG called Super Hydlide elsewhere), Juvei Quest (RPG), Kaijuu Monogatari (RPG), King of Kings (turn-based strategy, not Wisdom Tree's similarly titled platformer), Megami Tensei II: Digital Devil Story (RPG), Mindseeker (graphical adventure, feetured in HG101's "Your Weekly Kusoge"), Sangokushi II: Haou no Tairiku (strategy), Sangokushi: Chuugen no Hasha (strategy)


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:40 am 
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My first toedip into nes hobbyism was a romhack of Volleyball to be set it in Poland, 1955 - based on a photo i saw once and that students from around the world would gather at so called youth for peace conferences and youth festivals, of which one was held in Warsaw 1955.

I think it's the same reason you'd hack any team sports game - you want to update, vary or customize the teams, nations or rosters


I can understand that, and I have no problems with that. The problem is that these Tecmo Bowl games doesn't seem to change anything besides text (tough I could be wrong about that), nor even gameplay mechanics for that matter.
Is Super Bowl such a big thing in the US even today, that it needed more than 200 ROMHacks of that? : P

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:42 am 
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I know what you're talking about with respect to things like Goat Simulator. But are you including SimCity ("City Simulator") and Spore ("Intelligent Design Simulator")?


No. Only modern "simulator games".

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:49 am 
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Shin 4 Nin Uchi Mahjong


Speaking of that... I heard that this is the only game that uses the MMC5 PCM audio.
I have two NSFs for it, and I never saw via NSFPlay that the music tracks would enable the MMC5 PCM.

I'm guessing that it was used for SFXs or something else? I tried to play the thing, but I have a general tendency to suck at Mahjong games. :P
Not to mention... the composer for that game is unknown, but when I saw the memory usage, it kinda reminded me of Yoshio Hirai, composer of Startropics.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:55 am 
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It's a little weird what genre of games ended up with expansion sound. Maybe it's to simulate a more orchestral soundtrack?
But the games that really could use extra channels are space shooters and run'n'gunners - so that the pew pew doesn't interrupt the soundtrack.

Case in point: Nemesis for game boy has an excellent score on its levels (and a few other tracks are really good too), i think they're some of the best in the commercial era for game boy. A matter of personal judgment and a little nostalgia of course. But it seems to have been overlooked because half of it has been more or less unheard due to sfx.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:10 am 
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Probably strategy style rpgs, those kind where you advance characters across a map. real time strategy games too. I kinda liked Warcraft 2 ages ago, but it's not something I ever quite got a handle on.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:21 am 
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Both Metal Slader Glory, Uchuu Keibitai SDF and Shin 4 Nin Uchi Mahjong uses expantion audio only for sound effects, not for music itself. In other word, they use it to avoid having to steal a music channel to play sound effect, which is the "standard" way to do it on the NES and which doesn't always sound very good.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:30 am 
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Fair enough - all the more weird it wasn't more popular on shooters, Uchuu Keibitai SDF being the exception.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:32 am 
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FrankenGraphics wrote:
Nemesis for game boy has an excellent score on its levels (and a few other tracks are really good too), i think they're some of the best in the commercial era for game boy. [...] But it seems to have been overlooked because half of it has been more or less unheard due to sfx.

That and channel stealing is necessarily cruder on Commodore 64's SID and Game Boy than on other PSGs because of their lack of software volume envelopes. This means you can't resume an interrupted note so easily. But on Game Boy, which uses piecewise-linear hardware envelopes, I'll admit it can be worked around by tracking in software the progress of each envelope piece and restarting the remainder of that piece when the sound effect becomes less loud than the instrument. SID, not so much.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 8:35 am 
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Gimmick! uses expansion audio because, according to the developers, the producer was very passionated about making the perfect action game and knew exactly who to have composing the music. But the composer's chords didn't go well with only the 4 channels so they wanted to have a sound chip in the cart to help with this.


Back to topic, I'm a real omnivore and like about any genre. I'd like to say FPS as my least liked genre but even that genre have fantastic games like Goldeneye 007. Generally they are seldom aesthetically appealing though, and gameplay is also often boring. I never liked the genre from the start be it Wolfenstein 3D, Doom or Quake.

I'm a big fan of Adventure games, simulation and RPGs (even some Western RPGs). I understand that going through a simple menu to fight simple enemies without any required strategy is boring, and RPGs would be pointless if that was all there was to them. Thankfully that's not all there is. Although many older RPGs do contain little variation and lots of grinding which often means little strategy in most battles. The strategy isn't just battles though, it's about counting herbs and torches and taking decisions for survival. Another important part of RPGs is the world it takes place in. Even with simple or no graphics the world is painted in the player's imagination through the text on the screen, much like when reading a book without lots of pictures (I admittedly don't read lots of books though).


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