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Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 11:06 pm
by B00daW
So, I've been trying to get a hold of many different people to acquire a couple copies of these... The relevant information that I have found on them is located here:
http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/korea/ ... y-open.htm
http://sinfox04.egloos.com/6307944
http://bbs.ruliweb.com/hobby/board/3001 ... derby=good
http://blog.naver.com/may517?Redirect=L ... 0126808705
http://cafe.naver.com/joonggonara/239398180
http://blog.naver.com/may517?Redirect=L ... 0130720337
http://blog.naver.com/pollalla?Redirect ... 0110696361
From what I can tell, it looks like a hardware unit with a detachable microphone and miniature cartridges like the Camerica Aladdin unit designed by Daewoo. It also has an FM sound chip inside of it. The software was designed by Open Corp; the same people who designed Buzz and Waldog.
I had a brief conversation with "sinfox04" but he does not speak much English and doesn't have much interest in parting with his unit.
Anyone else have more information regarding this product; or have easy access to Korean markets?
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 3:14 pm
by mikejmoffitt
This looks a lot like the Famicom Titler to me. Never mind, I'm a dolt and didn't read carefully. You're talking about the cartridge, not the system
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 11:34 pm
by B00daW
mikejmoffitt wrote:This looks a lot like the Famicom Titler to me. Never mind, I'm a dolt and didn't read carefully. You're talking about the cartridge, not the system
It looks like they came packaged two ways:
With the Noraebang (Karaoke) unit stand-alone:
And included with a Famiclone (also by Daewoo):
It appears that the Daewoo Famiclone used some of the same chips that the Dendy did; a UA6527 and UA6528:
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:30 am
by MLX
And yes these things are hard to find plus expensive, even in Korea. There's another, way less known Karaoke cart by a company called Hicom.
Here's the PCB of that, if anyone is curious.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/151375036 ... ed-public/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/151375036 ... ed-public/
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:15 am
by B00daW
Fantastic news! Hrm... Those pictures aren't high-resolution enough to make out what's inside of them. :/ It also does not appear to look like the unit?
Well... The goal is to get the whole thing emulated. I was considering the fact if it needed to potentially be destroyed for science. Hopefully if we get better pictures and you get your hands on it, you can also figure out the mysteries.
Do we know the total amount of extension carts and which ones there are?
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:38 am
by MLX
I mentionned this was the other Karaoke cartridge that was released in Korea. Much smaller cartridge and has 3 times the number of song. Also less popular because it came from a smaller distributor.
As for the Daou's one, there are 4 known ext carts.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:04 am
by B00daW
Hrm... Interesting. So I'm not familiar with this other cartridge then. Destruction is obviously not the goal, but some chips cannot be dumped by desired means. I was just planning for "just in case."
Very interesting though! Is it the same program?
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:37 am
by lidnariq
B00daW wrote:Hrm... Those pictures aren't high-resolution enough to make out what's inside of them. :/
What? I mean, I can't RE it just from these pictures, but it's not because some of the part numbers are illegible.
Code: Select all
74????? 74LS00 74LS138 ⅛"jack resistorpile
74LS161 GD4066 MC3403P
74LS139 74LS273 74LS273 moreresistors
maskrom 8KRAM
I can certainly take educated guesses at what's going on—e.g. the GD4066 probably allows for software-adjustable volume control of the microphone.
But the real problem (to me) is that I can't see the traces that are under the ICs, especially the DIP ones.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 12:00 pm
by MLX
Dumping the chips won't be enough anyway, I'm positive this operates on a unimplemented mapper so you'd need to do hardware & software RE. So your best bet to get it dumped and emulated would be a person used to such items.
Add to that the necessary update to the emulator to provide mic input directly to the game as it expects it.
Not an easy task by any means.
And no, it's a completly different software. I do have a kazzo but I haven't done any attempt at dumping it because it obviously won't work on any common mapper (and it's the only Famicom game from this company so it's likely a singleton mapper).
I can take HD pics of the PCB if anyone needs/wants them. But I won't desolder any chip by myself.
I can also try to follow some traces with a multimeter but I got no time to do that at the moment.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 12:13 pm
by B00daW
OK... Well this is a secondary "Noraebang" item; and it's of interest as well, for sure.
Yeah! Might as well give us some more HD pictures of the cart and casing. That would be nice.
Do we know the name of this cart, the software maker, and hardware maker? Kazoo dumper or TapeDump may do the trick if we can figure out the mapping from pictures. Otherwise CopyNES is also a good solution.
My personal interest in the Daewoo cart is finding out the FM chip inside of it.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 12:20 pm
by MLX
Title: Kkachi wa Norae Chingu
Developper/Publisher: Hicom (You can see their logo on the pcb in fact, solder side, bottom left)
Video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LA1bjvaFiU
I'm not singing on the video but you can hear me blowing in the mic like an idiot (
) at the very end of the recording. The audio output is fairly nice tbh.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 1:01 pm
by B00daW
Thank you! I see the page here:
http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/korea/ ... -hicom.htm
Seems like this is a boolean sorta switch thing... The mic can tell whether or not air pressure is applied, then the signal is supplied to the cart. To emulate this we'd just also need to know which register value the mic is mapped to. Doubt it's the same as the Famicom mic?
In regards to dumping 까치와 노래친구 we would only need to dump the PRG and CHR ROMs.
No destruction would be necessary.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:43 pm
by MLX
Kkachi-wa is dumped.
>KKachi-wa Norae Chingu (K) (Unl).nes
It was UOROM, thanks to NewRisingSun for the support.
Now if it is possible or not to figure out how to feed the ROM with the microphone input it expects is another question.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:58 pm
by B00daW
Let's debug it. PM me with details.
Re: Family Noraebang (패밀리 노래방)
Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:55 am
by B00daW
Thanks.
Looks like it's reading two different addresses and comparing them... It's reading from $6000 and $6001. (These are likely the Mic (Force/Volume) Input values. Not sure why it needs two just yet...) Did most of the debugging with No$NES. To emulate this, we'd have to figure out the hardware of the mic input and the values that are stored/read. I'm not the greatest at hardware, but we'd have to trace hardware address $6000 and $6001 to the cart, see what it's connected to, and maybe look up a datasheet on those components.
Looks like bit 7 of $8000 is also mic enable?
The game is a 512KB UxROM.
This looks like the mic reader routine:
Code: Select all
CCED A5 00 LDA $00 // $00 address value starts as #$10 during karaoke
CCEF 85 01 STA $01 // set up bankswitching
CCF1 A9 80 LDA #$80
CCF3 85 00 STA $00
CCF5 8D 00 80 STA $8000
CCF8 8D 00 80 STA $8000 // mic enable? can't be 2MB PRG. ;P
CCFB EA NOP
CCFC EA NOP
CCFD AD 00 60 LDA $6000 // load mic input (a) byte?
CD00 6A ROR A
CD01 B0 40 BCS $CD43
CD03 A2 00 LDX #$00
CD05 86 67 STX $67
CD07 AD FF FF LDA $FFFF
CD0A AD FF FF LDA $FFFF // value of $FFFF is #$D3
CD0D CA DEX
CD0E F0 40 BEQ $CD50 // branch to other routine (not currently understood)
CD10 AD 00 60 LDA $6000 // load mic input (a) byte?
CD13 6A ROR A
CD14 90 F1 BCC $CD07
CD16 A2 40 LDX #$40
CD18 8A TXA
CD19 4A LSR A
CD1A 69 E7 ADC #$E7
CD1C A8 TAY
CD1D C8 INY
CD1E 30 FD BMI $CD1D
CD20 CA DEX
CD21 F0 12 BEQ $CD35
CD23 AD 01 60 LDA $6001 // load mic input (b) byte?
CD26 6A ROR A
CD27 B0 06 BCS $CD2F
CD29 E6 67 INC $67
CD2B EA NOP
CD2C 4C 18 CD JMP $CD18
CD2F AD 00 60 LDA $6000 // load mic input (a) byte?
CD32 6A ROR A
CD33 B0 E3 BCS $CD18
CD35 86 68 STX $68
CD37 A5 18 LDA $18 // value is #$01
CD39 09 40 ORA #$40
CD3B 85 18 STA $18
CD3D A5 1C LDA $1C // value is #$2C
CD3F 09 02 ORA #$02
CD41 85 1C STA $1C
CD43 A5 01 LDA $01 // value should still be #$10
CD45 85 00 STA $00
CD47 8D 00 80 STA $8000
CD4A 8D 00 80 STA $8000 // bankswitch?
CD4D EA NOP
CD4E EA NOP
CD4F 60 RTS
CD50 A9 00 LDA #$00
CD52 85 68 STA $68
CD54 85 67 STA $67
CD56 4C 43 CD JMP $CD43
CD59 A5 1C LDA $1C
CD5B 29 84 AND #$84
CD5D D0 5D BNE $CDBC
CD5F A5 11 LDA $11
CD61 29 78 AND #$78
CD63 D0 57 BNE $CDBC
CD65 18 CLC
CD66 A9 00 LDA #$00
CD68 A6 63 LDX $63
CD6A 30 02 BMI $CD6E
CD6C A5 63 LDA $63
CD6E A6 64 LDX $64
CD70 30 02 BMI $CD74
CD72 65 64 ADC $64
CD74 A6 65 LDX $65
CD76 30 02 BMI $CD7A
CD78 65 65 ADC $65
CD7A A6 66 LDX $66
CD7C 30 02 BMI $CD80
CD7E 65 66 ADC $66
CD80 C9 18 CMP #$18
CD82 90 0A BCC $CD8E
CD84 C6 63 DEC $63
CD86 C6 64 DEC $64
CD88 C6 65 DEC $65
CD8A C6 66 DEC $66
CD8C A9 18 LDA #$18
CD8E 85 4C STA $4C
CD90 4A LSR A
CD91 29 0F AND #$0F
CD93 85 4E STA $4E
CD95 A9 0C LDA #$0C
CD97 85 4F STA $4F
CD99 20 4A E9 JSR $E94A
Anybody have any more thoughts? (Edit: Fixed the offsets in the disassembly.)