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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2011 9:38 pm 
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naruko wrote:
Looks so cool!
こんにちわ。kazzo を設計した naruko です。時々覗いていましたが、写真を見てうれしかったです。

一つお願いがあります。revision を 3.0 にしていますが、私が1年前に採番しています。作り直すことがあれば、 1.1 以降を使ってください。最初の数字はいままで公表していませんが、利用した MCU で決めています。
1.x Atmega16 or Atmega164P (40pin)
2.x Atmega168 or Atmega168P (28 pin)
3.x Atmega8U2 or Atmega16U2 (AVR USB 32pin)

8U2 を利用した reivision 3.0 は作りかけたまま、開発の資料や時間が整わず私の部屋で眠っています。

Google translation: Looks so cool!
Hello. I'm naruko who designed the kazzo. Peeps were sometimes glad Look at the pictures.

One might ask. 3.0 has to revision, and a year ago and I Numbering. If you have to recreate, please use the 1.1 and later. The first number is not published until now, has determined that use of the MCU.
1.x Atmega16 or Atmega164P (40pin)
2.x Atmega168 or Atmega168P (28 pin)
3.x Atmega8U2 or Atmega16U2 (AVR USB 32pin)

Reivision 3.0 times using the 8U2 is still building, sleeping in my room 整Wazu development resources and time.


Thanks for commenting naruko! I didn't realize you were here on the forum, I should have checked. I've had several questions I meant to ask but didn't try to ask mainly due to the language barrier. I'll try to do so by use of PMs in the near future.

I appreciate the clarification on the revision numbers. I only saw 1.0 and 2.0 and decided to name mine 3.0 without much thought. So this version of the kazzo shall officially be Kazzo 1.1 nevermind the print of 3.0 on the board :) I'll make that correction for any future runs or builds.

SkinnyV wrote:
Very nice! You really seem to have done a great job at this infiniteneslives! Look very clean and professionnal and the PCB look amazing. And the nesdev themed color is a plus Laughing I'm very happy to see this thing becoming a reality and can't wait to see what kind of support the nesdev community will give in regard to new script/plugging writing. This is an exciting time indeed.


Thanks again for asking me to do this SkinnyV, I've had some fun with it. Yeah the purple PCB is really just a coincidence the supplier let's you choose any color you'd like just as long as it's purple :)


tepples wrote:
I wonder how much it'd cost to get these mass-produced to sell to the general public as a legit source of ROMs for emulators on PCs and smartphones.


Price could be cut a lot lower by using surface mount parts and the atmega8/16 from the 2.0 and 3.0 versions. It would also allow for the board to be smaller. Even the connectors price is cut in half with quantities in the 100's. I would guess it could be made for a cost of around $15 if a couple hundred were made and sell for $20-30. But I'm just throwing numbers out there.

SkinnyV wrote:
What would be cool would be to add support for sega genesis and snes, at a later point in the future of course. Then it would be a kick ass alternative to the retrode. Correct me if I'm wrong but dumping support for snes (with exception of special chip like sa-1, sdd-1, cx4 and the like) or genesis cart wouldn't be too complicated for a device like the Kazzo. I mean, the hard part is already done for dumping nes cart and I'm sure people will start sharing custom dumping script for unsupported mapper once it get shipped out so new console support could be something cool to hope for in the future imo.


I don't know a lot about SNES/Sega, but I think it would almost be simpler than the NES. The main reason being the mappers, from what I under stand that's why the retrode doesn't attempt NES.

By quick glance SNES only has 24 address lines, 16 Data, and 14 some control signals. Sega's about the same. So the kazzo could easily be adapted to connect up even if you sucked up 16 pins for the data bus. You could just I/O extend with a few more D-flipflops for the high address lines and uncommon control signals similar to what's done with the Kazzo.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:05 pm 
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They're HERE!

I slapped one together and am going through trying to test everything out before I send em off. Even after triple checking everything a mistake still got through... I swapped up the D+ and D- pins on the AVR :( Good news is it's an easy fix. I fixed the one by cutting the two traces and making the two connections manually that are only about 1/4" and 1/8" long. The other tricky way is to solder the two resistors in funky. Basically they were intented to be parallel to eachother, but really the board is wired up to have them criss-cross each other or they could wrap around one another. Either way there is still room and clearance for the AVR above.

For the guys getting kits just let me know what you'd like to do. I'll do whatever you'd like. I'll even solder in the affected components however you prefer if you feel uncomfortable about it. Just let me know.

EDIT: oh and the FC 60 pin connector works great too.

Image
Image
Image


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:08 am 
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If I understand correctly it is fixable just by crossing the resistor? If so, not a big deal IMO.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:19 am 
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SkinnyV wrote:
If I understand correctly it is fixable just by crossing the resistor? If so, not a big deal IMO.


Yeah that's it. Not a big issue just more of an embarrassment.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:36 pm 
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Haha well that was to be expected, you really tried to make that board fast and you were dealing with a lot of stuff at the same time for ordering part etc... Could have been way worse!

I was wondering though, how long does it take for someone to figure out and write a plugging for an unknown mapper? I mean someone with knowledge of such thing. I realize it is very relative and will depend on a lot of factor but I'm just trying to get an idea of the work involved.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 3:59 pm 
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SkinnyV wrote:
Haha well that was to be expected, you really tried to make that board fast and you were dealing with a lot of stuff at the same time for ordering part etc... Could have been way worse!

I was wondering though, how long does it take for someone to figure out and write a plugging for an unknown mapper? I mean someone with knowledge of such thing. I realize it is very relative and will depend on a lot of factor but I'm just trying to get an idea of the work involved.


Yeah I'm still happy with how they turned out, I guess these could be considered "limited edition" :) It's also convenient that they are under the AVR so you actually can't even see the error and it's fix if you do the resistor cross or wrap around fix.

That's kinda a tough question to answer. The scripts would seem to be fairly simple for someone thoroughly knowledgeable with the NES and the mapper under question. I found the NROM mapper script online and have since become a little more familiar with the scripts with that I was able to modify the UNROM script to UOROM but that was a super simple change. The only script missing to allow dumping for the most common mappers is MMC1. There is a SLROM script but nothing for SEROM of the other common boards. I'm sure it would be an easy adaptation to make scripts for the other boards but I haven't spent any time with it yet.

This is probably the best site to help explain the scripts (google translated), other than that I referred to the source code when I played around with the flash scripts.
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Funagi.sourceforge.jp%2Fcgi-bin%2Fhiki%2Fhiki.cgi%3Fhow%2Bto%2Bdescribe%2Bmapper%2Bscripts

Here is my uorom.ad script all I had to do was change the cpu rom size of the UNROM.ad. But I think there is another way to do it by denoting 2x size of the UNROM script.
Code:
board <- {
   mappernum = 2,
   cpu_romsize = 2 * mega, cpu_banksize = 0x4000,
   ppu_romsize = 0, ppu_banksize = 0x2000,
   ppu_ramfind = false, vram_mirrorfind = true
};

function cpu_dump(d, pagesize, banksize)
{
   for(local i = 0; i < pagesize - 1; i += 1){
      cpu_write(d, 0x8000, i);
      cpu_read(d, 0x8000, banksize);
   }
   cpu_read(d, 0xc000, banksize);
}


I thought it would have been provided with the code download but it wasn't. So here's a nrom.ad script I found here some kind of project page with flash carts and stuff: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fbakutendo.blog87.fc2.com%2Fcategory14-1.html

nrom.ad (note: .ad is for dumping scripts and .af is for flash scripts)
Code:
board <- {
mappernum = 0,
cpu_romsize = 0x8000, cpu_banksize = 0x4000,
ppu_romsize = 0x2000, ppu_banksize = 0x2000,
ppu_ramfind = false, vram_mirrorfind = true
};
function cpu_dump (d, pagesize, banksize)
{
cpu_read (d, 0x8000, 0x4000);
cpu_read (d, 0xc000, 0x4000);
}
function ppu_dump (d, pagesize, banksize)
{
ppu_read (d, 0, banksize);
}


nrom.af
Code:
board <- {
   mappernum = 0, vram_mirrorfind = true,
   cpu = {banksize = 0x4000, maxsize = 0x8000},
   ppu = {banksize = 0x2000, maxsize = 0x2000},
};
function initalize(d, cpu_banksize, ppu_banksize)
{
   cpu_command(d, 0, 0x8000, cpu_banksize);
   cpu_command(d, 0x02aa, 0xc000, cpu_banksize);
   cpu_command(d, 0x0555, 0xc000, cpu_banksize);

   ppu_command(d, 0, 0x0000, ppu_banksize);
   ppu_command(d, 0x02aa, 0x0000, ppu_banksize);
   ppu_command(d, 0x0555, 0x0000, ppu_banksize);

}

function cpu_transfer(d, start, end, cpu_banksize)
{
   cpu_program(d, 0x8000, cpu_banksize);
   cpu_program(d, 0xc000, cpu_banksize);
}

function ppu_transfer(d, start, end, ppu_banksize)
{
   ppu_program(d, 0x0000, ppu_banksize);
}


There's some other project pages that can be found with some simple google searches. Just be ready with the translator


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 4:17 pm 
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Thanks for the info, I'll read a bit about it but I really doubt this is within my realm as I do not know any programming language and lack the required knowledge for such a thing. I was asking because I have a bunch of pirate famicom cart from the same maker (or at least it look that way) that I would like to be able to dump with the kazzo.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 9:50 pm 
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Memblers and SkinnyV your kits shipped out today.

OldNESJunkie and Tepples yours will ship on Tuesday.

A note on the bootloader: So I actually was able to corrupt the bootloader sector the other day playing around with the bootloader software. It resulted in needing to reload the bootloader firmware with an AVR programmer. Not a great situation if you don't have one, but I would be happy to help out reloading it for someone who may have an issue.

I'm not certain but I think it happened as a result of not following the 3 steps in the HIDbootflash software. First you connect to the device, then select .hex file to be loaded, and finish by flashing the AVR. I was being a little sloppy and disconnected before flashing. So when I reconnected the software still was in the connected state and let me try to flash even though I should have reconnected. The flash failed and then I couldn't reconnect no matter what I did.

It shouldn't really be an issue especially if you never play around with the bootloader and it's software. But just be aware if you do, to flow the proper steps if in doubt just reconnect before trying to flash. But aside from that one time I've swapped back and forth from the kazzo firmware and my own firmware dozens of times with ease.

EDIT: here's some pictures of all that's included with the kit (FC connector optional)
Image


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 2:20 am 
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the purple pcb looks so cool :D


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 1:08 am 
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Had some requests for the .pcb and .sch files I've also included the library files I created with all the NES/FC connectors and everything. I used Design Spark to create the boards

kazzo rev1.1


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 1:52 am 
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How can I open the files?

I coundn't use Protel 99 and Proteus to open them. Which software (and version) should I use?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 7:41 am 
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FARID wrote:
How can I open the files?

I coundn't use Protel 99 and Proteus to open them. Which software (and version) should I use?


http://www.designspark.com/

Current version is what I used


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 7:51 am 
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I just want to make sure, is it DesignSpark PCB version 2 with 73.3MB size and free?

http://designspark.eu/downloads/released/programs/Setup.exe


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 8:55 am 
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FARID wrote:
I just want to make sure, is it DesignSpark PCB version 2 with 73.3MB size and free?

http://designspark.eu/downloads/released/programs/Setup.exe


Should work. You'll have to add the library files to see the connector and a few other things. I think I may have put the switches and other items in a different library though. If its an issue let me know which components and I'll gather up those libraries as well for you.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:27 pm 
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I just received my kit today and went straight to assemble it. Only problem I had was I soldered the cap without thinking it needed to be layed flat since the MCU is right on top:) I hope it didnt break because I had already cutted the excess pin so It was a challenge to get it to lay flat with the little ammount of pin lenght left. Oh well it would be trivial to go buy another cap in case of a problem anyway. I didn't had the time to really test it past installing the driver and using the test executable coming with the software package and even then I'm not sure if it told me it was find or not. Only thing is the led doesn't light up. I'm pretty sure I soldered it the right way though. Is it supposed to light when the switch is set to ON or to show transfer activity?


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