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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:09 pm 
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Alp wrote:
my disgust, at the idea of Cat Quest being put on KickStarter. (I consider it a tool for scammers to make easy money, or for developers to be lazy.)

Then how else is someone supposed to feed himself while working on a project of larger scope than a single person can handle in the time remaining after a full-time day job, housekeeping, and sleep? If the game's producer is a programmer, he needs to hire artists, or vice versa.

Espozo wrote:
If people really cared that bad about their game, I really feel they could make it without money, considering it's pretty much free to make one.

In a market economy, you can't make a game without money. You can't even stay alive without money, as rent and food cost money.

So is there a better model than Kickstarter for funding the development of games larger in scope than the "single-screen puzzle games" that certain regulars here have given me heck for making?

rainwarrior wrote:
I never understand the strong feelings people seem to have about what other people do with their own money.

Perhaps someone fears that scamming may become "the new normal". For example, "what other people do with their own money" is buy video game consoles instead of gaming PCs, which forces third-party developers to spend extra money on the overhead of obtaining a console devkit just to make and sell their games. And because "what other people do with their own money" is buy PCs, you can't be sure that GNU/Linux will work on a brand new major brand laptop (see DebianOn listings for T100TA and X205TA).


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:10 pm 
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Espozo wrote:
I never thought that someone would ask for enough money to where they wouldn't still work though.

I can't speak for other developers, but I certainly wouldn't be able to have a full time job (that hardly respects the theoretical duration of a workday, as is common in my line of work), take my daughter to school and pick her up, shop for groceries, cook dinner, clean the apartment, and still find time to develop a complex game.

If I were to develop a game for good, I know I'd have to be paid at least part-time for it, while still doing something else to get the rest of the money I need to support my family.

Espozo wrote:
For the same reason people care about others committing suicide.

That's a bit extreme, considering how irreversible suicide is. A lot of people do care about aspects of other people's lives that are none of their business though, such as who they sleep with.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:29 pm 
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tepples wrote:
"single-screen puzzle games" that certain regulars here have given me heck for making?

Since I probably am one of these regulars you're talking about, I'd like to take this opportunity and apologize for anything I might have said that wasn't nice. I've always been too ambitious with my own creations, and used to look down on simpler projects. But now I can see the merit of the smaller games, and I'd honestly much rather have one fun, well polished, single screen puzzle game under my belt than nothing at all. You can shine making whatever kind of game you want, just work well and make sure you're releasing a polished product, not a half-assed mess that barely works.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:31 pm 
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Espozo wrote:
For the same reason people care about others committing suicide.

This is an absolutely disgusting comparison to make, and I am strongly offended.


Last edited by rainwarrior on Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:36 pm 
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@Alp

I, for one, was looking forward to your game, and I'm sorry to hear its cancellation.

And, I personally have found "the community" to be helpful and friendly. If you don't enjoy it anymore, I guess it makes sense to move on. Good luck with your future endeavors. :)

[Edit, some comments removed, because I actually do know some of those people, now that I read it closely]

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Last edited by dougeff on Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:40 pm 
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tokumaru wrote:
That's a bit extreme, considering how irreversible suicide is.

It was a terrible example, but the point I failed to make was that people (to an extent) do care about each other and what's best for them (if they don't despise them). That's the only way we could have gotten to where we are now. Or maybe I'm just looking too deep into this... :/

tepples wrote:
Perhaps someone fears that scamming may become "the new normal".

That's probably more like it. :lol:

dougeff wrote:
I personally have found "the community" to be helpful and friendly.

It seems that some of those people at Nintendo Age were fairly unpleasant. It seems like when he was referring to "the community", it was mostly them.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:50 pm 
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Espozo wrote:
people (to an extent) do care about each other and what's best for them

Different people have different priorities, though. I for example find it silly that people pay as much as they do for a new iPhone, while they could buy an awesome Samsung or Motorola for half the price, but that's their choice, and it would be rude of me to interfere with their decision.

Everybody who works knows how much their money is worth (and those who don't probably don't have to worry about money anyway), and what they're going to trade it for is a decision that only they can make.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:10 pm 
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tokumaru wrote:
Espozo wrote:
people (to an extent) do care about each other and what's best for them

Different people have different priorities, though. I for example find it silly that people pay as much as they do for a new iPhone, while they could buy an awesome Samsung or Motorola for half the price

It's not an individual app user's choice to make a particular proprietary app exclusive to iOS. It's the same reason you need to buy a Nintendo 3DS to play Animal Crossing: New Leaf or Super Smash Bros. For, even if you use a PlayStation Vita or an Android-powered tablet for the rest of your gaming.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 9:24 pm 
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tepples wrote:
It's not an individual app user's choice to make a particular proprietary app exclusive to iOS.

True, and who are we to question the iPhone buyer/owner if he thinks that this app (or any other) is worth the difference?


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:09 pm 
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Hey, it's been a while, so I thought I should probably make an update.
My schooling has taken up more of my time than I expected, so I have been spending less time on this than I'd like, apologies for that.
Anyway, after working on a certain design of music engine for long enough, I realized that with the changes I was making it might have been easier to start from scratch with a simpler design. However, I've yet to re-restart, as I think I should probably design a GUI first - if I have to manually put in one more note I'll explode.
As for actual tracks, I have 8 total, with one or two in rough state, three reasonably complete, and the rest in between. (Most of them aren't yet assigned to a specific level.) I finally got the overworld track written, by fiddling around and stumbling upon something that just clicked. No earlier attempt got an appropriate feel, and even still the one I ended up with is a little pop-like, but it's the best I've done so far, and I'm actually a bit proud of it.
Unfortunately (once again :roll: ) I can't really show you guys anything right now, since I haven't been directly using any music engine for writing--
Alp wrote:
But this game, and all other game-related projects is CANCELLED.
Oh.
Alp wrote:
If my game didn't have a dedicated composer, this reaction would have made me dump the game in the Recycle Bin, and called it a day.
...


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:52 pm 
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Quote:
actual tracks, I have 8 total


I'd love to hear your music.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 20, 2015 7:38 pm 
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dougeff wrote:
I'd love to hear your music.

Just remember, I warned you that these tracks were not in a presentable state: most of them have too few sections, and all the drum sounds are placeholders.
Most of the tracks are single-section loops that I've made to play twice so you can see how they would have looped. Once again, be warned!

Zip of nine mp3 files, 15 MB

Comments for each track, ordered from most to least awful:

dunno.mp3: Shrill, dull, and short. Not sure where it would have gone had I made it less terrible.

lair.mp3: Equally short. To think that it's my best attempt at something that sounds menacing...

0-title.mp3: I'd put this further down, but you've probably heard this track before.

1-menu.mp3: Same.

trash.mp3: One of my first attempts at an overworld/title theme. Obviously inadequate.

fast.mp3: Another attempt at overworld/title; fortunately, less inadequate.

4-forest.mp3: I knew that a lot of my stuff would end up either "sounding sad" or "sounding happy", so I decided to write the Forest Temple first of the temples, because that was the first and most light-hearted.

5-lake.mp3: Sounds like forest, i.e., not really appropriate for any other temple's theme, let alone the water temple's.

2-overworld.mp3: I might have overstated the quality of this track. I'm not proud of how it sounds now - I haven't written any other parts or transitions. Had I 20-30 hours to work on all of these, I would have been able to consider most of them complete AND acceptable.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:25 pm 
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I like "lake", but it feels more like the end of the game, credits are rolling. But, I think that if you dropped the drums and made it smoother, it would work great for a opening title theme.

Some of these are pretty good. If anyone else is working on a Zelda game, maybe you can still use them.


(On an unrelated note, it looks like Alp took down all the pictures of the game. Two years from now, if someone is looking through old posts and wondering what this game looked like - it was a bit like Link to the Past.)

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 20, 2015 8:51 pm 
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[Removed at Alp's Request]

The .CHR files still exist in earlier posts: viewtopic.php?p=134663#p134663
Or here: viewtopic.php?p=134769#p134769

I tend to just save everything, because images get lost/artists nuke their gallery/other stuff.

I got a lot of stuff in my pixel art collection that's not on the web anymore.

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Last edited by Kasumi on Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:47 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2015 4:26 pm 
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For those who don't understand what's going on here: Basically, someone at Nintendo Age was talking about kickstarter - offhandedly mentioned Cat Quest, and Alp was offended (apparently he has a low opinion of people using kickstarter)...and they argued, and some people said some insulting things, or at least some things that Alp took negatively. And, that's about all I know.

Sucks, huh? I'd love to see this game finished too.

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