Freedom fries

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darryl.revok
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Freedom fries

Post by darryl.revok » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:17 am

In [url=http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?p=169660#p169660]this post[/url], Bregalad wrote:And also they're not refereed to as "America", which refers to the whole continent in our language (i.e. "The Americas" in English).
You know, this is a problem for us as well. It's a problem that I ran into during my earlier post.

There are people in this forum from South America, Central America, and Canada, and none of those places, as I understand, have the same sort of wide spread anti-french sentiment. If they do, it's for other reasons. However, you can't say US Americans.

What are we supposed to call ourselves? I really don't know!

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dougeff
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Re: NesDev compo 2016

Post by dougeff » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:18 am

Chips
Too confusing. We already eat a different potato product called "chips".

I believe that's 'pommes chips' in French. Or 'croustille'.?
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dougeff
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Re: NesDev compo 2016

Post by dougeff » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:26 am

Interesting that they (republicans in congess) changed it to 'freedom fries' over France's opposition to invading Iraq...a decision that 45% of Republicans now admit was a mistake.
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mikejmoffitt
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Re: NesDev compo 2016

Post by mikejmoffitt » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:31 am

Bregalad wrote:
Freedom fries woo!
I don't understand why they need to make up a new word for this, when there is a proper word in English language : "Chips".
"Freedom Fries" was a name born out of political sentiment. It did not catch on, and I have never met anybody in the US who uses it. "French Fries" is pretty common, but "fries" is certainly the dominant term where I live. Regarding "chips", as dougeff mentioned, we already have a product called chips that are... well, chip shaped. In the same way poker chips are chip shaped.
This is not what this thread is about.

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Broke Studio
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Re: Freedom fries

Post by Broke Studio » Fri Apr 29, 2016 10:27 am

I believe that's 'pommes chips' in French. Or 'croustille'.?
In France, that's what we call "chips" (=crisps) :
Image

And this is what we call "frites" (=french fries) :
Image
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Bregalad
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Re: Freedom fries

Post by Bregalad » Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:15 pm

Yes, but it is a false friend. English chips = French frites. Just like thousand of other false friends on this list for example.
There are people in this forum from South America, Central America, and Canada, and none of those places, as I understand, have the same sort of wide spread anti-french sentiment.
You forgot Mexico, which is in North america but not USA :)

And Québec is probably the place in the world where france is most hated :mrgreen:
Last edited by Bregalad on Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Freedom fries

Post by dougeff » Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:21 pm

And Québec is probably the place in the world where france is most hated :mrgreen:
I thought it was the other way around. I've heard that French people find the Québec accent especially... bad.
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Dwedit
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Re: Freedom fries

Post by Dwedit » Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:42 pm

Yay! I finally get to use this one: http://freedomfries.ytmnd.com/ (might need to quickly click to activate flash before it's hidden)
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Myask
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Re: Freedom fries

Post by Myask » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:30 pm

Bregalad, [url=http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=14113&start=75#p169660]in this post[/url] wrote:
I thought of that, but as an American, I'm obligated to dislike anything that seems French. Nothing I can do about it; it's in the contract. :D
Don't worry, the United States of America are also cordially detested here. And also they're not refereed to as "America", which refers to the whole continent in our language (i.e. "The Americas" in English).
Freedom fries woo!
I don't understand why they need to make up a new word for this, when there is a proper word in English language : "Chips".
...in British English. «Les Américains sont très différents des Anglais.»

And even if you don't for the country, you do use "American" to describe things from the US, and its citizens.

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Sogona
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Re: Freedom fries

Post by Sogona » Fri Apr 29, 2016 8:56 pm

Is it true that "Les États Unis" doesn't necessarily refer to the USA?

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Re: Freedom fries

Post by Sik » Fri Apr 29, 2016 10:46 pm

darryl.revok wrote:What are we supposed to call ourselves? I really don't know!
In Spanish we have the term "estadounidense" for that... the problem is that the direct English counterpart ("unitedstatian"?) is practically unpronounceable, and that's saying a lot considering the language in question.

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koitsu
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Re: Freedom fries

Post by koitsu » Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:13 pm

The noun "American" is an awkward word. It attempts to cover too much (lacks granularity). By definition, it can refer to someone who was born, or actively resides in, North America or South America. Also by definition, it can refer to someone who was born, or actively resides in, the United States.

This is compounded by fact that the noun "America" (singular) is multipurpose and just as awkward: it refers either to any of the Americas (North, Central, South), or refers to the United States specifically (see below for colloquial usage). The number of times I've witnessed people (already in heated discussions) nitpicking over use of this word is astronomical.

In my experience (as someone from the United States) that many of us here in the States forget that North America, as Bregalad mentioned, includes both Canada and Mexico. Canadians seem to be more aware of this fact and use the terms correctly (better education? Better grasp of geography? Unsure); they also use the term "American" to refer folks in/from the United States.

In American English, we don't really have a term that *exclusively* refers to people from the United States. The closest we've got is "American". The irony is that many folks born in the United States forget that the word encapsulates more than just the country they live in. In turn, you have to go off of context, and/or ask questions ("Wait, by 'American' did you mean folks from the Americas or just the United States?").

TL;DR -- the terms American and America require one key off of context, and often add strain/stress during conversations that are already volatile (esp. if involving politics).

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Re: Freedom fries

Post by rainwarrior » Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:44 pm

Ask any canadian if they're "american" and they'll tell you no. Generally speaking, "american" is not used to refer to people from any part of the Americas. It only refers to the United States of America, in any English context I'm aware of. This isn't a usage limited to the USA.

The two main exceptions I can think of are historical contexts that predate the existance of the USA (e.g. discussion of Columbus' exploration), and of course people pointing out that "technically American means anyone from both continents".

The default usage is just to refer to the USA, and unless you've prepared a context that makes it clear you're using it the other way, you will be misleading people (i.e. using it wrong). If someone asks you whether you're "american", they normally want to know if you're Usanian*.

The meanings of words change over time. The fact that the word has "america" in it is merely a historical consequence (etymology). Just because that's where the word came from doesn't mean it hasn't changed since. The nitpicking about this meaning is just something for people to say when they're bored.


* I made this word up, it is not valid.
Last edited by rainwarrior on Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Freedom fries

Post by lidnariq » Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:50 pm

rainwarrior wrote:Usanian*.
[...]* I made this word up, it is not valid.
Much to my surprise, apparently there's a notable cited history of using that word.

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rainwarrior
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Re: Freedom fries

Post by rainwarrior » Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:56 pm

LOL, I had never looked for other usage but I'm not surprised.

I also like to think it's pronounced with a u: instead of yu: just so it sounds more like Hussein, the middle name of its current president, among other things. ;)

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