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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 11:24 pm 
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Yeah... Thoughts on this seemed to be mixed. I'm sure everyone here who cares about the Nintendo Switch has already seen it, but I want to know what you thought. To be honest, I thought it was a major letdown. For every good moment, there were ten bad in between, and even the good moments were disappointing (Splatoon 2 summer release? Super Mario Odyssey winter release? What the fuck, are there only two games coming out for this thing at launch?). It started out with disappointment after disappointment, then picked up with Splatoon 2 and Super Mario Odyssey, and then fell of a cliff with a piss poor production value Xenoblade 2 trailer and never recovered, arguably getting even worse, listing a bunch of games from has-been Japanese developers and a port of a 5+ year old game that anyone who has already wanted to play has, and EA, which speaks for itself. Probably the best I felt post Super Mario Odyssey was the human translator malfunction; that was hilarious. :lol: By the time they talked about The Legend of Zelda Breath of the Wild, I just wanted to go to sleep, and I was even fairly excited for it.

$300 is bullshit for what this is, and paid online is even worse (especially considering the main game I'm getting this for is 90% online... Remember the good old days when people would make fun of Microsoft for being the only ones too make you pay for online? Yeah... :( ). HD Rumble is 3D Touch (well, Nintendo and Apple are "buddies" now...), the motion sensor thing is next to useless (and is only on one remote. Great thinking, considering the main point of having them detatch is to use them as two controlers) and you might as well huddle in a cardboard box and try to pretend you're having fun if you're thinking about playing 1, 2, Switch. And ARMS... What a piece of shit; I might not hate it as much as I did if they didn't give it as much attention as they did. I love how they even needed to do a gameplay demonstration video (that they didn't do for any other game) and the announcer's half hearted attempt to sound interested. It's like if you threw Monkey Fight (taking out the dumb fun) and an Arena Shooter in a blender, (gimping it in every way possible, making it much slower, less projectiles, basically removing the arena part, and everything else), then took a shit on it with ugly character design and lame premise that even a six year old would be ashamed of.

Oh, and one last fuck you to Nintendo for no F-Zero. There was one part of the stream (I think the part with "ARMS") where the comments were mainly people asking about F-Zero. Instead of reviving a beloved franchise, they create a new shitty one.

...I just realized I was a lot more angry than I thought... :lol: This was almost my exact reaction: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-jDQhOtTpQ (Rich is a bit of an asshole, but I like him. I think he's very honest even if he doesn't know what he's talking about half of the time. :lol: ) I'm really excited for Splatoon 2 though, although he realizes that this is definitely one of the best games announced. I hope those are all the specials, as I don't want any of the BS invincibility ones the first game being carried over. These all look a lot more balanced. The roll dodge is awesome, (only for the pistols, but I'm not surprised) although I heard the fact you roll by jumping while shooting in another video is not good... There are several unused but easily accessible buttons left available, so really, what the heck.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 11:41 pm 
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Espozo wrote:
Oh, and one last fuck you to Nintendo for no F-Zero. There was one part of the stream (I think the part with "ARMS") where the comments were mainly people asking about F-Zero. Instead of reviving a beloved franchise, they create a new shitty one.

Be careful what you wish for.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:00 am 
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This is not a SNES dev forum ?

I say this because I come here, only to read / reply to the SNES dev and not to anything else.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:32 am 
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Yeah this should be in General Stuff.

Espozo wrote:
the motion sensor thing is next to useless (and is only on one remote. Great thinking, considering the main point of having them detatch is to use them as two controlers)

I thought both Joy-Cons had the accelerator sensor and gyro sensor. Otherwise games like ARMS wouldn't work. Only Joy-Con R has the Motion IR Camera and the Amiibo Reader/Writer though, judging by the livestream conference.

Big let-down for payed online service, I don't use it nearly enough for it to be worth paying for.

Big thumbs up for region freedom!

I'm looking forward to it, mainly for Zelda and Mario though. A new Fire Emblem is always exciting but it seems to be more of a Fire Emblem-themed Musou game. But I agree with Espozo that it's time for another F-Zero that can compete with F-Zero X.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:34 am 
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I think fans built up this presentation into something it was never supposed to be. I think it was mostly supposed to be a fairly detailed explanation of the product we saw that one ad for last fall, with a sampling of pending software to illustrate the point, ending on the crowd-pleasing announcement that Zelda (contrary to previous rumours) is going to make launch. We already know there are games coming that weren't announced. They could be holding stuff back for E3, or even standalone announcements; they never promised to show everything at this one event.

Even if there were an F-Zero game well along in development, showing it now would cannibalize Fast RMX, which is no way to treat Shin'en.

$300 is IMO not terrible considering the tech involved. It's not just the custom SoC (which AFAIK we still don't have official details on), or the screen (and apparently the screens on the demo units at least are quite nice) or the battery and the rest of that stuff; those Joy-Cons are pretty packed. I hear the gyro/accel is very accurate, and apparently the "HD Rumble" is super impressive... Also, for some reason they're charging an arm and a leg for the dock by itself, which implies that the dock hardware isn't trivial either (there's precedent - laptop docks can cost as much as the whole Switch).

Skyrim was just rereleased for PS4 and XBOne, neither of which is portable. I don't think it's clear that there's no market for this game (or that it's the original rather than the remaster or a custom Switch version. I am aware that people express strong opinions on message boards, but it doesn't mean much, especially several months away from release). It is uncomfortably reminiscent of Mass Effect 3 on Wii U, but I don't see that it's quite the same situation.

EA will be EA, I guess. If this thing catches on and FIFA sells well, maybe they'll step up.

The bit where they had a couple of developers come out and say they were working on stuff, and then not show anything, did fall kinda flat IMO...

As for 1-2-Switch and Arms, perhaps they just aren't aimed at you. (They aren't aimed at me either.) I think they're reasonably impressive in their originality - the contortions you had to engage in to come up with an analogy to describe Arms speaks volumes, and 1-2-Switch is (incredibly enough) a video game you play without looking at the screen. EDIT: I decline to give any further opinion of either game at this point. Insufficient data.

...

I guess what I'm saying is "don't jump to conclusions".

...

I'm with you on paid online. In fact, they can take that phone integration and shove it. I don't have or want a smartphone. I realize I'm in the minority here... (Then again, I don't play games online either...) Hopefully they address people's concerns and provide a service customers are comfortable paying for...


Last edited by 93143 on Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:44 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:37 am 
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1. Excess of "new experience". Even with the Pro Controller (much like the XBOX ONE design), they were appealing to a multi-independent units, together with a mobile connectivity - notice the bluetooth' tech for the controllers, plus sticking them to the tablet. Plus, the mobile experience again - a tablet instead of a console table, but a dock. Hardcore gamers (or even casual gamers) will NOT replace a traditional gaming experience fully by a mobile experience! NAH!

2. The mobile is "the right way". Probably NOT focused on portability as you might think. Now you'll charge 3 batteries, now you'll play in a tablet with bluetooth controls. Now you'll get less power if compared with the table consoles like PS4 or XONE.

3. No retrocompatibility. Keep your WiiU to play the games... or re-buy them later in the Nintendo (App) Store. Signs showed me a stupid external WiiU disc reader accessory... but perhaps I'm wrong on my guess. ^_^;;

4. ?Hardware? What's the hardware specs? What are you buying!?

5. ?Games? Let me skip it... and...

6. Super Mario universe... in a CITY!? No fantasy-style like in Super Mario Sunshine, at least!? No. A coincidence with that Mario demos using the Unreal engine?


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:47 am 
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Perhaps they'll finally do a Pokemon MMO.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:29 am 
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93143 wrote:
I think fans built up this presentation into something it was never supposed to be. I think it was mostly supposed to be a fairly detailed explanation of the product we saw that one ad for last fall, with a sampling of pending software to illustrate the point, ending on the crowd-pleasing announcement that Zelda (contrary to previous rumours) is going to make launch. We already know there are games coming that weren't announced. They could be holding stuff back for E3, or even standalone announcements; they never promised to show everything at this one event.

This surprises me. I haven't looked much at message boards, but what else do people think this is supposed to be but a conference that reveals more details about Switch? I didn't think it would have that much of a bad reception. Maybe I'm too much of a Nintendo fanboy to see the bad. We haven't even got the technical specifications for it yet.

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Even if there were an F-Zero game well along in development, showing it now would cannibalize Fast RMX, which is no way to treat Shin'en.

Yeah let's hope that Nintendo have plans. I'm all for new franchises but I'd like to see old established franchises that I grew up with continue to thrive as well.

Zepper wrote:
1. Excess of "new experience". Even with the Pro Controller (much like the XBOX ONE design), they were appealing to a multi-independent units, together with a mobile connectivity - notice the bluetooth' tech for the controllers, plus sticking them to the tablet. Plus, the mobile experience again - a tablet instead of a console table, but a dock. Hardcore gamers (or even casual gamers) will NOT replace a traditional gaming experience fully by a mobile experience! NAH!

2. The mobile is "the right way". Probably NOT focused on portability as you might think. Now you'll charge 3 batteries, now you'll play in a tablet with bluetooth controls. Now you'll get less power if compared with the table consoles like PS4 or XONE.

Well Nintendo has always been number one in the portable console market since the days of Game & Watch (save for the launch of the 3DS), so a portable system is a logical step now when their home console won't sell. Bluetooth technology has been used since the Wii, tablets since the Wii U.

Quote:
3. No retrocompatibility. Keep your WiiU to play the games... or re-buy them later in the Nintendo (App) Store. Signs showed me a stupid external WiiU disc reader accessory... but perhaps I'm wrong on my guess. ^_^;;

Yeah I actually initially thought the docking station was gonna have an optical drive, so you can play disc games at home and cartridges on the go. The optical drive would also make it possible to play Wii and Wii U games I thought. Guess they scrapped backwards compatibility though.

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4. ?Hardware? What's the hardware specs? What are you buying!?

Yeah this! I wanna know too! Guess it can't be too powerfull since it's portable and the price isn't PS3-/PS4-expensive. Well all it really needs is good games from third-party developers.

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6. Super Mario universe... in a CITY!? No fantasy-style like in Super Mario Sunshine, at least!? No. A coincidence with that Mario demos using the Unreal engine?

I think it looks like fun. The Mario series has never been about logical realism.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:07 am 
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Kinda-sorta realistic cities are part of the universe. I seem to remember the Super Mario Bros. 3 cartoons making trips to the "real world" in numerous episodes. Mario Is Missing, Luigi's solo debut years before Luigi's Mansion, took place in Earth cities. Both were third party but approved by Nintendo.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:46 am 
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Yeah but I doubt they count as cannon. There are Japanese cartoons too and there Mario is also in a more real world and travels to the more fantasy Mushroom Kingdom world (allthough those cartoons are probably not cannon either). NOA even sugested Mario was from Brooklyn and American cartoons, movies and comics built uppon that (including Mario is Missing). AFAIK none of the cannon games ever makes any references to Brooklyn (the English SimCity manual does but not the Japanese one as far as I can tell so it's probably something made up by NOA).

But what about Donkey Kong and Mario Bros? Mario was a carpenter, and later plumber (and also had other jobs in Game & Watch games) in urban environments before he went to the Mushroom Kingdom when Princess Peach was kidnapped in SMB. But on the other hand Yoshi Island suggests he was born in a place similar to Mushroom Kingdom (it has mushroom-shaped houses), so it's best not to think too much about all that.

Interesting enough there's a sign in the Mario Odyssey trailer that says "New Donk City" and a street sign saying "Dixie ST", so that's Donkey Kong references allright.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 12:17 pm 
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koitsu wrote:
Be careful what you wish for.

You're saying they can't match F-Zero GX? :lol:

Kannagi wrote:
This is not a SNES dev forum ?

Oh, I'm an idiot... Because this is the forum I comment on the most, I often just type "SNESDEV" into Google and follow the link. I wasn't thinking.

Pokun wrote:
Only Joy-Con R has the Motion IR Camera

Yeah, that's what I meant. I don't think the lack of Amiibo sensor on the other controller is any big deal though. You normally use those in a non gameplay setting where you can wait to take turns with the sensor. I doubt the Motion IR Camera will be used much if at all, so it doesn't really matter, but if you're going to do it at all, you might as well go all the way. I just realized that I don't think this thing will have a camera, but the cameras that Nintendo puts in their devices have always been or really bad quality anyway.

Pokun wrote:
I agree with Espozo that it's time for another F-Zero that can compete with F-Zero X

You mean F-Zero GX? There were the two Gameboy Advance games after F-Zero GX, but I don't count those for a couple reasons. (Whoever though turning a game into a TV show and back into a game is an idiot, not that this type of thing hasn't been done before though.)

93143 wrote:
Even if there were an F-Zero game well along in development, showing it now would cannibalize Fast RMX, which is no way to treat Shin'en.

Survival of the fittest! The main reaction to Fast Racing Neo seemed to be "It's not F-Zero, but it will do for now."

93143 wrote:
the contortions you had to engage in to come up with an analogy to describe Arms speaks volumes

I wouldn't have an anti-ARMS bias if they didn't drag out the presentation of the game for 5 minutes. They totally overestimated how much people would care about that game, and I don't think the people who care about 1 2 Switch or ARMS would wait to watch a one hour livestream.

93143 wrote:
EDIT: I decline to give any further opinion of either game at this point. Insufficient data.

I think Nintendo took care of that with ARMS...

93143 wrote:
The bit where they had a couple of developers come out and say they were working on stuff, and then not show anything, did fall kinda flat IMO...

The translator made it worth it. :lol:

93143 wrote:
they can take that phone integration and shove it.

If it truly was like a phone (play over LTE) that would be badass.

Zepper wrote:
?Hardware? What's the hardware specs? What are you buying!?

I don't think they want you to know. (You can figure that out... :( )

Zepper wrote:
Super Mario universe... in a CITY!? No fantasy-style like in Super Mario Sunshine, at least!? No. A coincidence with that Mario demos using the Unreal engine?

I immediately thought of Sonic Adventure. It's not quite as ridiculous as that...

Pokun wrote:
Yeah let's hope that Nintendo have plans. I'm all for new franchises but I'd like to see old established franchises that I grew up with continue to thrive as well.

They have so many they left for the dump. Too bad they botched Star Fox.

Pokun wrote:
Interesting enough there's a sign in the Mario Odyssey trailer that says "New Donk City" and a street sign saying "Dixie ST", so that's Donkey Kong references allright.

That was awesome. I think I heard there was an Expresso and Winky street too (unless people are pulling my leg.)


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:13 pm 
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Pokun wrote:
But what about Donkey Kong and Mario Bros? Mario was a carpenter, and later plumber

Mario Mario Sr., sometimes known by his rap name "Jumpman", was a carpenter. His sons Mario Mario Jr. and Luigi Mario are plumbers, and he's got a granddaughter named Rosalina. It's just a theory.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:34 pm 
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I feel 1 2 Switch is a game that is mostly there to demonstrate what the joycon and the portability brings to the table, and as such, i think it should be a pack-in.

80 3rd party developers is a bunch. I wonder how many will have something presentable within the first month from release.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 2:05 pm 
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WheelInventor wrote:
and as such, i think it should be a pack-in.

It will be BS if that game is $60. Although my birthday is March 1st, I think I'm going to hold off buying one until the summer. By that point, there might be a Legend of Zelda or Splatoon Pack in (The two games I will get that will have been out.) Hell, even if there's a 1 2 Switch pack in, it's better than nothing.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 2:30 pm 
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Espozo wrote:
You're saying they can't match F-Zero GX? :lol:

No. Think about what you're asking, re: "reviving a beloved franchise". There is no way to "revive" such a thing and have it take on the exact same feeling as the original. Do you really want me to start listing off horribly failed "reboots" of classic games, as well as films? (They both suffer from the same driving force, and the same failure)

Again: be careful what you wish for.


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