YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Discussion of hardware and software development for Super NES and Super Famicom.

Moderator: Moderators

Forum rules
  • For making cartridges of your Super NES games, see Reproduction.
User avatar
kyuusaku
Posts: 1665
Joined: Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:13 pm

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by kyuusaku » Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:28 am

NightWolve wrote:I think, however, it would strike some, myself included, as a little, oh, I dunno, racist, RACIST, RACIST!!! ;)
Personifying my sentiments through a popular figure who may or may not be of the same ethnicity as myself strikes you as racist? If I call you Honey Badger since Honey Badger just doesn't give a s**t about video signals (it tweaks what it wants!) would it strike you as speciesist? (Or is that genusist?)
your attempt to generalize me (and still from a position of arrogance)
I'm failing to find a generalization. Perhaps you could use examples? Would it be a generalization to say that your main takeaway from this thread is that resistors aren't readily available in every value? This is perhaps my most minor criticism of the work, but the one you keep coming back to.
I wonder perhaps because you also had a hard-on for me before I even got here
I did? I don't recall ever communicating with you before this thread--we don't even hang out at the same spots. If you hadn't shown up we never would have. Your reputation had preceded you with me, once, by way of an old PCE acquaintance who I guess scuffled with you about 10 years ago over something (maybe credit?) I cannot remember, and I don't even remember the message board. I know very little about you personally--and I'm more than fine with that.

You've had many opportunities to learn from the criticism with grace. Instead you're intent on staying ignorant of video signals and standards, transistor operation, transmission lines, perhaps even Ohm's law.

This is what I know (all substantiateable):

-you built a video driver (which you colloquially call an amplifier despite it not performing signal amplification) by way of circuit-bending and around unfounded pretenses.
-you receive engineering advice from a purportedly professional EE friend, whose qualifications are suspect upon approval of this work.
-you assert that electrical theory and manufacturability problems I've thrown at you is "nitpicking".
-you've self-promoted the work, and defended it from critique using logical fallacies and by throwing someone who had tried your circuit (and may or may not have built it correctly) under the bus.
-you appear to have an appetite for attention/theatrics/prosing, but through your posts you have projecting these attributes onto myself, which astute readers hopefully will find as confusing as I have. Every post I've made responds to key points with appropriate concision. Correct me if I'm wrong.
-you've resorted to arbitrary off-point personal attacks, emotional outbursts and irate private messages. I can't even intellectually see the humor in them, maybe a tiny bit in the PM and latest few emoticons.
-you've call me a "heckler" about a dozen times, as if you were a stand-up comedian and I'm ruining your act (if this is an act, what exactly are you getting out of it?)
-this board has numerous individuals better educated than myself, who I'm sure also find fault in the circuit and your retorts but are too polite, too entertained, or maybe are too concerned for your mental well-being to join in; there have already been numerous tech-quacks to grace the board with their work and pontifications on binary matters, who breakdown when too many speak out.
Anyway, I do humbly apologize for not noting that the 80 Ohm resistor was actually a "preferred" labeled 82 Ohm type from any general resistor kit but understand that I just didn't realize nor ever expect that I'd have a nitpicking nutjob that would catch something so trivial like that, and harp/heckle me down over it
This sounds like revision to me but in any case I've maintained that this isn't the point. 80 or 82 ohms, the value doesn't make any engineering sense. You chose/found this value because the result appealed to your eyes, upon your TV set, calibrated to your settings, when paired with your SNES and your transistor + accoutrements. If the value made for a repeatable driver circuit faithfully delivering the signal to the load with fair conformance and even moderate efficiency I wouldn't care; but it doesn't, and that's the bottom line.

I can't say it was a pleasure, but it's been educational for me as well.

User avatar
NightWolve
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:15 pm
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Contact:

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by NightWolve » Thu Feb 06, 2014 3:55 pm

kyuusaku wrote:Personifying my sentiments through a popular figure who may or may not be of the same ethnicity as myself strikes you as racist? If I call you Honey Badger since Honey Badger just doesn't give a s**t about video signals (it tweaks what it wants!) would it strike you as speciesist? (Or is that genusist?)
Yes, as I said, I found your choice rather curious and I never heard of her. It might just speak to what you think of black people, a kind of stereotype as portrayed with that image and the ebonics cast on her with the "ain't" usage, so yes, there could be some racial undertones there having chosen this... I also like how you cast doubt on your race, floating the possibility that you could be of the same race as her as a response. Well, your first link, at this time, fails to load, and I don't really care to click the other ("ain't" got time for it, your nonsense that is, heh!) . Anyway, yes, a most excellent contribution to the thread! Thanks!!
I'm failing to find a generalization. Perhaps you could use examples? Would it be a generalization to say that your main takeaway from this thread is that resistors aren't readily available in every value? This is perhaps my most minor criticism of the work, but the one you keep coming back to.
Failing, yes, a concept you're rather familiar with. The content of your meme "Correct NightWolve?? Ain't nobody got time for that." attempts to generalize me as impossibly arrogant to correct. The arrogant one claims generalized arrogance at the other party, that it has been generally incorrect, and tries (tries, not actually succeeds) to be funny about it with something some would find questionable/offensive, etc. It also does possibly bring into question some sort of long standing issue, like you knew me or something and brought in additional negative baggage. Not an unreasonable possible interpretation or conclusion.

And as for your attempt to shift the issue onto resistors, you're the one that kept crying/heckling about "preferred values," not me! I didn't somehow indicate I used a pot to force an exact 80 Ohms in that schematic... It goes back to the point, rather than ask/probe further since I entered the thread, you just went on the attack. You're a shoot-first type of jackass, in addition to the rest of it, being abrasive, arrogant, elitist ("Rawr, you losers aren't trained engineers doing this! It makes me mad!"), hypocritical, etc. I see a massive superiority complex like I've not seen in a long while! There's literally not even a single case of you admitting to anything wrong; you completely lack the ability to admit that you've been wrong in anything or guilty of jumping the gun, etc. What an amazingly excessive level of pride there! Instead of owning up to anything, you just shift the issue like the weasel that you are!
kyuusaku wrote:
I wonder perhaps because you also had a hard-on for me before I even got here
I did? I don't recall ever communicating with you before this thread--we don't even hang out at the same spots. If you hadn't shown up we never would have. Your reputation had preceded you with me, once, by way of an old PCE acquaintance who I guess scuffled with you about 10 years ago over something (maybe credit?) I cannot remember, and I don't even remember the message board.
The thought occurred to me, that's why I voiced it out loud. I didn't declare it a fact, so don't go getting carried away with it!! You didn't have to go into such detail! Granted, with troll hostilities, you're gonna seize upon whatever wrong guesses might be put forward to reduce your embarrassment and have something else to attack with, so I understand your little speech there. Anyway, I simply posed a possibility, as I said, your meme made me wonder. So OK, point noted, you had no prior grudge with me, and your attempt to generalize me with that meme is entirely just from posts in this thread then... Fairy enough.

As for this PCE acquaintance you brought up and crediting, it sounds like Derrick Sobodash or "D-Boy," who once falsely accused me of not crediting him in the Ys IV translation project on his blog. When I discovered the accusation, I contacted him, showed the ReadMe to his face and the crediting that was *always* there for his font application (feidian) and help, etc. So, that issue was resolved. But, that is the problem with passive-aggressive behavior and not first communicating with the person who you feel you have a problem with, before making and spreading accusations publicly.

Oh BTW, what's this "we" business ? This, "If you hadn't shown up we never would have." ?? We never would have ? What is that, the royal 'we' usage or just a proofreading failure on your part or ?? Letting something slip there ? No, pffffft, never mind, don't bother answering that.
kyuusaku wrote:I know very little about you personally--and I'm more than fine with that.
Likewise! Like you think you're gonna hurt with me that. Heh. You're nothing but contemptible as far as I'm concerned!
kyuusaku wrote:You've had many opportunities to learn from the criticism with grace.
Hah, talk about something so self-applicable! How fantastically hypocritical!
kyuusaku wrote:Instead you're intent on staying ignorant of video signals and standards, transistor operation, transmission lines, perhaps even Ohm's law.
Here we go again! It's breathtaking to watch this, really! I remember your pre-edit version of a prior post, where you made a more inflammatory accusation in the form of, "YOU DO NOT RESPECT THE SCIENCE!!!! RAAAWRRR!!!!" like a madman, a wild-eyed, blatantly false and unfair accusation! But, you later decided to edit it out and toned it down somewhat, of course, now it's back in a different form given your anger level... Heh. You're pathetic, that's the truth!
kyuusaku wrote:This is what I know (all substantiateable):
Right, a list of your distortions, exaggerations, straw men, revised history, etc. of my positions and this situation in general. Well done!
kyuusaku wrote:-you built a video driver (which you colloquially call an amplifier despite it not performing signal amplification) by way of circuit-bending and around unfounded pretenses.
It's a basic transistor amp and yes, it actually does amplify the signals in question. Why wouldn't it ? AFAIK, that basic circuit design is referred to as a transistor amp, a "common-emitter amplifier" circuit, etc. and I'm not responsible for starting that reference, but I see in your hysterical quest to find all sorts of possible attacks to continue on, it doesn't surprise me you came up with this one, apparently holding me accountable, selectively, for the general, colloquial reference of "transistor amp" found throughout the Internet, even Wiki which you previously linked, and in use by most others, etc. I don't hear others refer to such designs as "video drivers" much. Sorry about that... Ever hear the expression "selective outrage?" Anyhow, not much else to say to this... I do hate to take the bait on your nonsense and waste more of my time, but I'm not gonna leave your garbage/spin unanswered.
kyuusaku wrote:-you receive engineering advice from a purportedly professional EE friend, whose qualifications are suspect upon approval of this work.
Ah, I see. Going after his credibility now. Problem is that steve has actually made worthwhile contributions to many gamers, be it his repair/mod jobs or the design of a general RGB->YPbPr circuit which was pressed onto a PCB and currently being sold/installed, etc. Unlike JROK, the design is out there for free for those willing to build it themselves. Compared to him, you're just a little bitchy bitch, emphasis on the little.

I told him about this thread actually, specifically the 1K issue and a transistor breakdown scenario. He said that, yeah, at 5 Volts, the chances are next to nil for transistor breakdown, but added the ole "Never say never..." So, he stood by that. He also agreed there's current waste with the pull-down values, but it's acceptable. And once again, that's the range SNES engineers used for Luma/Y, so it wasn't this great offense that you hysterically claim that it is!

But no, his qualifications are just fine as far as I can tell, minus the amazing arrogance and superiority complex that you so clearly exhibit here. I'd say if anyone's qualifications are suspect and not to be trusted, all signs point to YOU! BTW, if you wanna attack him to his face, since you're feeling so uppity, I'd be happy to provide you with his contact info.
kyuusaku wrote:-you assert that electrical theory and manufacturability problems I've thrown at you is "nitpicking".
Strawman. No, I assert that your nitpicking of the 80 Ohm issue, when it was a solid resistor all along, when it was physically labeled 82 Ohms, and it only ever could've been following a "preferred value" standard as the industry appears to manufacture them based on this standard, THAT was nitpicking! Ultimately, a difference of 1-2 Ohms compared to what professionals use for the Luma/Y and you're STILL at it!!
kyuusaku wrote:-you've self-promoted the work, and defended it from critique using logical fallacies and by throwing someone who had tried your circuit (and may or may not have built it correctly) under the bus.
Yes, it's called sharing hobby work that you've become interested in, just as others have shared their circuits in here as well, much to your displeasure. And to claim I threw somebody under the bus is absurd, blatantly dishonest! I simply pointed out that the first schematic of mine that he shared here was done so privately via PM, and I wasn't quite confident enough with it to share publicly since I was still experimenting. It was sort of a rough draft version and I put it together quickly for him though it was written in a way in preparation for eventually making it public. The newer one was my choice to publicly share. So yes, my preference would've been not to have publicly shared the first one that I made for him. It was incomplete, didn't tell you what to do for Luma/Y, and it appears now you might not need an amp in some cases, etc. I changed the default output resistances as well relative to my 1990 motherboard obviously.
kyuusaku wrote:-you appear to have an appetite for attention/theatrics/prosing, but through your posts you have projecting these attributes onto myself, which astute readers hopefully will find as confusing as I have. Every post I've made responds to key points with appropriate concision. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Honestly, you're a joke at this point. "Rawr, every thing I've done has been correct, point to point, everything you have done has been confusing, incorrect, attention-seeking, etc." Nice little version of your "history" there.
kyuusaku wrote:-you've resorted to arbitrary off-point personal attacks, emotional outbursts and irate private messages. I can't even intellectually see the humor in them, maybe a tiny bit in the PM and latest few emoticons.
Well, given a prick of your caliber, I think everything's been pretty justifiable... I don't care what humor you can't or can see in anything here, so spare me. Also, you got ONE PM to both trash you and put you on notice that I had posted here again after months from our last exchange, so falsely reporting it as plural shows, yet again, how you like to play fast and loose with the truth.
kyuusaku wrote:-you've call me a "heckler" about a dozen times, as if you were a stand-up comedian and I'm ruining your act (if this is an act, what exactly are you getting out of it?)
I've called many others hecklers when I felt it appropriate, so don't go thinking it was just you. Your attempt to read further into that was just to set up your insult of a stand-up comedian act as another means of attacking my credibility. Hell, if anybody is the comedian, or rather, the joker here, it'd be YOU, hands down! I mean, aside from all your other antics, you're that one that brought that curious meme into this thread that you're so proud of, aren't ya ?? Heh.

As for what I'm "getting out of this," first off, I never would've had a DAMN thing to say to you. Not a single word. It was YOU that picked a fight with me, and you got one! Secondly, why don't just you finally f--k the hell off then, and not concern yourself with what I am or am not "getting out of this" ? Instead, you chose to once again engage with me further, made more inflammatory responses to provoke me, but then turn around and claim, for me, it's an "act..." You tried to embarrass me, and flaunt or pimp out your "I'm a trained EE, you're not!" credentials, your "I know better than you," but instead the only embarrassed one here wound up being you, and you're butt-hurt about it. I understand, and I'm really sorry about that, but take a good look in the mirror as to why this exchange worked out the way that it did... ;)
kyuusaku wrote:-this board has numerous individuals better educated than myself, who I'm sure also find fault in the circuit and your retorts but are too polite, too entertained, or maybe are too concerned for your mental well-being to join in; there have already been numerous tech-quacks to grace the board with their work and pontifications on binary matters, who breakdown when too many speak out.
Oh, I see, so now we're making assumptions about other people, appealing to them and perhaps hoping they'll join in, huh ? Awwww, poor fella, he had to do this all by himself, for the good of the Internet (or rather, his superiority complex), but he knows many agree with him in spirit and takes comfort from that...
kyuusaku wrote:
NightWolve wrote:I do humbly apologize for not noting that the 80 Ohm resistor was actually a "preferred" labeled 82 Ohm type from any general resistor kit
This sounds like revision to me but in any case I've maintained that this isn't the point.
There's no revision, sir. The liar calling me a liar essentially. And it's funny, now that the issue was explained to you, you shift in approach with a, "Uh, well, that wasn't the point anyway, rawr!" See if you can understand: I bought a standard 500 resistor pack from Radioshack, took an 82 Ohm resistor out of it, measured it with a DMM at 80 Ohms, and so 80 Ohms is what I wrote on my visual schematic, but I didn't get to add a footnote/detail at the bottom, to let the reader know that it's a labeled 82 Ohm resistor. That would create confusion because the labeling on a resistor pack would never show 80 Ohms, so it was an oversight on my part. A footnote that I'm using ACTUAL resistance values on the schematic should've been there in principle, etc. Especially now that I know there are nitpicking nutjobs like you that'll seize upon something like that to attack overall credibility of someone.

And no, YOU are the one revising! You repeatedly made a point to complain that part of why the circuit doesn't make ANY sense is because 80 Ohms isn't a "preferred value." When I pointed out that SNES engineers put together two 39 Ohm resistors for a total of 78 Ohms, which ultimately equals 79 Ohms when you measure the resistance fully across, you defended that by stating 39 Ohms is a preferred value, and once again continued on attacking 80 Ohms because it wasn't. You even posted Wikipedia links defining "preferred values" emphasizing some sort of importance! And finally, now that an oversight on my part was revealed, that it was in fact a "preferred value" of 82 Ohms, straight from a standard resistor pack, you f--king shift the issue and emphasize that something else was your point! You've made MANY points, never a SINGLE one! You're a f--king piece of work, that's for DAMN sure! Think I can't follow your f--king bullshit ?? Let's recall how you also seemingly suggested to go lower, back down to 75 Ohms, even while emphatically stating 80 Ohms wastes loads of current, etc.!

You get checkmated on one point, then move on to the next, emphasize something else, claim, well, THIS was what was really the main point or problem, etc.! Sure, in this case, part of it was my fault for not somehow noting that issue in the schematic, that the resistor I pulled out of my pack/kit is labeled 82 Ohms, but notice how you use whatever you can, then when it falls apart, you jump around to another issue to continue on with a sustained attack, etc. You're a troll! There would never be a, "Oh, I see, it was a preferred value all along." You're far too arrogant, bigoted, and prideful, etc. to make concessions like that. When you could use an appearance of lack of "preferred values" to attack, you did so, but now you're having to STFU about it and de-emphasize it! F--king a$$hole!

Tell me, a$$hole, since you're so smart, does the industry manufacture solid resistors that don't conform to the "preferred value" standard ?? As I said, it was my fault on the schematic (Notice how I am capable of admitting to fault there in sharp contrast to an egotistical monster like you!), but, I'm just wondering since, you know, you're so smart, how come it didn't occur to you that it was probably NOT possible for me to be in possession of a mal-sized resistor that doesn't conform to sizing standards of some type ? Where do I get resistor packs that don't conform to the "preferred value" standard because I looked around (not much, admittedly), but I'm not finding them ??
kyuusaku wrote:80 or 82 ohms, the value doesn't make any engineering sense.
Um, we've been over this... It's 80 Ohms, reality-wise, and SNES engineers wound-up using 79 Ohms reality-wise for the Luma/Y signal, so close enough you f--king lunatic!!!! I'm tired of repeating myself! If 79 Ohms made engineering sense for the Luma/Y, that range, to get started with for the layman, would seem good enough. Your attack still appears to be from a position sort of demanding that only trained engineers should be attempting this. That's what it would seem like. You're judging me from a high standard as if I was pretending to be a fully trained engineer and this was THE *perfect* circuit that was offered, etc.
kyuusaku wrote:You chose/found this value because the result appealed to your eyes, upon your TV set, calibrated to your settings, when paired with your SNES and your transistor + accoutrements. If the value made for a repeatable driver circuit faithfully delivering the signal to the load with fair conformance and even moderate efficiency I wouldn't care; but it doesn't, and that's the bottom line.
No actually, I didn't! Wrong again, surprised ? I chose it because general resistor packs don't include a 75 Ohm resistor and so I was left with the choice between 68 Ohms and 82 Ohms, all following your precious "preferred value" standard, so I took the 82 Ohm one (which is 80 Ohms in reality). Simple enough. And since 79 Ohms is what SNES engineers used, your insistence that it's just wrong has little merit, and speaks of your troll nature, I think. Still wanting to pretend you had a point and showing more of your arrogance! So yeah, I was looking for a 75 Ohm resistor just because of some general knowledge as a layman about the 75 Ohm standard for video signals, but my resistor pack didn't offer that value as a solid resistor, and then after seeing more video circuits for this situation, I concluded it wasn't a great offense to go a little higher.

Correction: What I chose, and what everyone must choose, based on the appeal to their eyes, upon their TV sets, is the final output resistance after the emitter and preferably after a capacitor if you're "respecting the science" and caring about filtering out the DC offset. And given all the motherboard revisions, and other factors, etc. you're gonna want a 0-100 Ohm pot for that aspect. You have also revealed more of your lack of hands-on, even though it appears you're formally book-trained in EE. If you knew what the f--k you were talking about exactly, you would know that the exact purpose of that pull-down resistor is so that the video signal will go through the DC-filter capacitor! This situation is practically binary, that is, with no pull-down resistor, the signal doesn't go through the capacitor, so you get nothing on the output! You wouldn't be able to tell the difference visually with 80, 100, 500, (of course if you short it, by going too low, way under 75, you'll weaken/kill it altogether) etc. The signal either goes through or it doesn't, in general! Now, if you don't care to filter out the DC-offset, after you remove the capacitor, you don't need that pull-down resistor anymore, but you would need a bigger resistor in series because now there would be less attenuation. The point IS my eyes couldn't have led to this exact choice via tweaking, something that applies to the final output resistor (which is what you were thinking of), dumbass!

Now, notice the difference between you and me when I made a guess versus your guess about the 80 Ohm resistor and how I came to choose it. In my case, I simply posed the possibility, it made me wonder when it came to your meme and your overall harassment of me, my circuit, I wondered, did this nutjob have some prior grudge with me. It appears now you just have a general chip on your shoulders and I was a random target that came into your cross-hairs. Fair enough. No further dispute there even though you seized upon my wrong guess to make a speech. On the other hand, you arrogantly declared the reasons for my choice as fact, as part of a list of things that you "know to be true and that can be substantiated." Heh. There are no qualifiers like "probably," as in, "You probably chose this value because of x, y, or z, etc."

So yeah, just thought I'd point that out. You still haven't decided to be a little more careful when you make your "proclamations" against someone, etc. Somebody has to kick you off that high horse, cause clearly, you'll never get off of it.

The other thing I would say about this attack is, repeating myself again, it goes without saying that since I'm not a trained electrical engineer, that my circuit wasn't designed with a scope and/or with deep knowledge about video signals, etc. and so I can't offer anything more than some general starter circuit for fiddling that works, but isn't professional, so your harassment is selective since a few other circuits here are by people who are not trained engineers as well. But as was eventually and repeatedly pointed out, that 80 Ohms for a pulldown value didn't turn out to be the great offense that you claimed that it was and still do! You wanna still cry about the 1K Ohm resistor or diode between the base of the transistor and the video chip, be my guest, but I'm still gonna use it up to and until, a professional EE with hands-on experience cracks open their SNES and works out designing a basic transistor amp given all the available knowledge now present.
kyuusaku wrote:I can't say it was a pleasure, but it's been educational for me as well.
I guess the sarcasm wasn't obvious. Heh.
Last edited by NightWolve on Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:03 pm, edited 9 times in total.
My Ys Fan Translation Projects.
http://www.ysutopia.net/

Markfrizb
Posts: 524
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:17 am
Location: East Texas

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by Markfrizb » Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:23 pm

This is getting ridiculous. I can't even bring myself to read these posts. It's getting beyond juvenile. I can't be the only one who feels this way.........
Nightwolve, we ALL GET IT. YOu believe you're right and resorting to name calling and petty points isn't doing you any good. As a bystander in all this, you need to let this all go. It seems like you are trying to prove something to the world (or this group at least). Whether you see it or not, Kyuusaku comes across as the more reasonable person and you are acting like your feelings were hurt.
I suggest you two parts ways and stop edging each other on.
Again, I'm just a bystander here giving my opinion on this. I may regret this..... But I can't be alone in this viewpoint. Maybe do your sparring in PM's???? Airing all this in public isn't advancing anything good or constructive.

My 2 cents

User avatar
NightWolve
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:15 pm
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Contact:

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by NightWolve » Thu Feb 06, 2014 6:47 pm

Markfrizb wrote:This is getting ridiculous. I can't even bring myself to read these posts. It's getting beyond juvenile. I can't be the only one who feels this way.........
Nightwolve, we ALL GET IT. YOu believe you're right and resorting to name calling and petty points isn't doing you any good. As a bystander in all this, you need to let this all go. It seems like you are trying to prove something to the world (or this group at least). Whether you see it or not, Kyuusaku comes across as the more reasonable person and you are acting like your feelings were hurt.
I suggest you two parts ways and stop edging each other on.
Again, I'm just a bystander here giving my opinion on this. I may regret this..... But I can't be alone in this viewpoint. Maybe do your sparring in PM's???? Airing all this in public isn't advancing anything good or constructive.
I can't believe you would classify him as "reasonable!" Did I talk to myself all this time with his 80 Ohm nonsense, when it was a "preferred value" 82 Ohm resistor all along and the way he arrogantly shifts to something else after his attacks fall apart ?

No, if you didn't read all the points, if you can't bring yourself to do so admittedly, then you don't get to act as a fair-minded bystander, pick a side like that, and just point to the insults, use that to null out the merits of why there's a conflict here in the first place! Facts are still facts, emotions aside! People can still make fair, objective judgments without using combative personality issues to sway them entirely in one direction or the other. But I realize I'm new here, and veteran-backup is gonna be a factor.

Was his meme image here "reasonable" ? You wanna stand by that too ?

And yes, I was insulted and highly irritated, or rather, disgusted by his approach and antics. Why wouldn't I be ? When he finally STFU's, I'll happily drop it. He wanted the last word in, I suspect, with that distorted summary of his of our exchange, so that wasn't gonna stand. Don't make wild accusations that I wanna prove something to the "world" or "this group." He wanted to pick a fight, I gave him one. He wanted to embarrass me, so I returned the favor. It isn't any more complicated than that. I try not to let people step on me. If you think that's about you or others, then you're mistaken. Overall, I let him know that I wasn't gonna take his shit, and sure, he's some kind of trained EE or something, but boy, he's not as smart as he thinks that he is! If I was gonna get modded/stopped, then fine, but as I said, he wanted to pick a fight, he got one. If you can't see a massive superiority complex with that guy, then I dunno what to tell you. You've not paid attention or it's for others reasons.
Last edited by NightWolve on Thu Feb 06, 2014 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
My Ys Fan Translation Projects.
http://www.ysutopia.net/

Markfrizb
Posts: 524
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:17 am
Location: East Texas

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by Markfrizb » Thu Feb 06, 2014 7:07 pm

I'm not going to get drug into all this nonsense. I've read every post except for this last full page one. You've made your points (valid or not) and now it's time to move on. I don't know you and I don't know him. I am a bystander. People so impassioned in trying to prove their point(s) are sometimes clueless how they come across to everyone else. My contention is you aren't aware how you are portraying yourself to everyone else. ....Cut off your nose to spite your face.

Anyways, I won't post anything further. Feel free to PM me if you want.

My 2 cents

User avatar
kyuusaku
Posts: 1665
Joined: Mon Sep 27, 2004 2:13 pm

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by kyuusaku » Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:14 pm

Feel free to get the last word in. This will be my final post in the thread because honestly I'm embarrassing myself by continuing.
attempts to generalize me as impossibly arrogant to correct.
Not impossibly, nor specifically arrogance. It's that you're unwilling to accept any information provided, unless somebody else corroborates it. If it came from anyone but me I'm sure you'd be more receptive.
And as for your attempt to shift the issue onto resistors, you're the one that kept crying/heckling about "preferred values," not me!
The only reason I brought up preferred values was because it established the premise that you used a potentiometer to pick a value by sight, not formula. I thought you admitted this, which would be telling to most technical people. Anyways since then you've admitted and demonstrated that you don't really know what you're doing, so we can drop it. Next time maybe put a disclaimer so people don't assume.
it sounds like Derrick Sobodash or "D-Boy,"
It's not. I don't know the specifics and I haven't talked to this guy in ages. At the time he felt bullied and shared his sentiments in our chatroom.
Oh, what's this "we" business ?
"We never would have communicated". I know you can follow sentence to sentence.
Likewise! Like you think you're gonna hurt with me that.
You claimed I had a hard-on for you (assuming I'm male), as if I'm knowledgeable about you and/or have some ulterior motive for my posts. I don't, and I need to clear that up for posterity.
Hah, talk about something so self-applicable! How fantastically hypocritical!
So far I haven't received any on-topic (about the driver) criticism from you. You've tried to disrepute my criticisms with anecdotes, but you haven't presented anything I can even reflect upon because nothing has challenged my understanding of the electronics. I'm always eager to learn something new.
It's a basic transistor amp and yes, it actually does amplify the signals in question.
Sort of and no. The signal in question is represented by voltage. The transistor is arranged as a "voltage follower". The transistor's job in this arrangement is to transform impedance; it's an analog voltage buffer. The signal out is actually smaller than what went in due to the non-linearity of real transistors. It's an amplifier in the sense that it allows for a high impedance signal to drive a low impedance load, "amplifying" the signal/voltage source's current capacity, by lowering its impedance, but it does not amplify the signal's amplitude.

This would pertinent information for somebody considering modding their console because what they want (a compliant driver) has voltage gain to achieve the correct output impedance.
but it's acceptable.
It's really not considering that all current is supplied through the 7805 which regulates voltage by burning up excess power. Plus you even mentioned that the transistors got hot... This would be why.
That's the range SNES engineers used for Luma/Y, so it's wasn't this great offense that you claim that it is!
(Once AGAIN) it's all about the biasing. If your signal has a significant DC offset, which it does, it *is* a great offense to waste current with an arbitrarily small emitter resistor.
Strawman.
No. You completely changed your tune once you realized the value of 75 ohms has some sort of significance, that is the theory you called nitpicking.

Also it isn't just a difference of 1-2 ohms, because your "79 ohms" figure is wrong; the resistors you're referring to are not equivalent to your emitter resistor, plus for the final time, the Re value in one circuit isn't necessarily appropriate in another circuit. *refer back to biasing*
I simply pointed out that the first schematic of mine that he shared here was done so privately via PM, and I wasn't quite confident enough with it to share publicly since I was still experimenting.
That's fine, but my point wasn't about him, it's about you vehemently defending the circuit over the experience of others.
I changed the default output resistances as well relative to my 1990 motherboard obviously.
In a properly designed circuit, this wouldn't be necessary.
you got ONE PM
This is true, I misspoke. Wasn't intending to exaggerate.
Oh, I see, so now we're making assumptions about other people
Not assumptions.
takes comfort from that...
No I was hoping you'd consider the possibility that this thread isn't reflecting well upon you. I realize that it's turned unbecoming of me for numerous reasons.
took an 82 Ohm resistor out of it, measured it with a DMM at 80 Ohms
OK, if you say so.
I was looking for a 75 Ohm resistor just because of some general knowledge as a layman about the 75 Ohm standard for video signals
Come on...
And given all the motherboard revisions, and other factors, etc. you're gonna want a 0-100 Ohm pot for that aspect.
With a reasonable design (preferrably op amp/negative-feedback) no tweaking is necessary because it will conform to established standards.

User avatar
NightWolve
Posts: 24
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:15 pm
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
Contact:

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by NightWolve » Fri Feb 07, 2014 3:40 am

kyuusaku wrote:This will be my final post in the thread because honestly I'm embarrassing myself by continuing.
Oh OK, well, I thought you were doing that long time ago.
kyuusaku wrote:
attempts to generalize me as impossibly arrogant to correct.
Not impossibly, nor specifically arrogance. It's that you're unwilling to accept any information provided, unless somebody else corroborates it. If it came from anyone but me I'm sure you'd be more receptive.
False, I noted the fact that I switched down from a 470 uF to 220 uF cap for multiple reasons between the old and newer design, not that the 470 uF was outright wrong given the RCA DVD module, but yeah. Other than that, the rest of your "information" was just heckling about 80 Ohms, the "preferred value" game that you played and lost, all in the face of the fact that SNES engineers used 79 Ohms all along for the pull-down resistance for the Luma/Y amplifier, so I stand by that. You claim the 1k resistor is needless, that's fine, steve admits breakdown is next to nill (but "never say never"), but I don't mind it being there as a precaution. So yeah, that's like 2 issues, and off of this, you want to cast generalizations and whatever else. But yeah, you've long since lost credibility with me, so why would I want more info from you given this type of exchange ? Heh. That's not arrogance on my part, it'd be more like exhaustion at this point. You made statements, I tried to verify them, and found otherwise, so yeah, loss of credibility. It's pretty brazen of you to somehow think that you deserve 100% credibility with me, or some high level of it after all this!
kyuusaku wrote:
And as for your attempt to shift the issue onto resistors, you're the one that kept crying/heckling about "preferred values," not me!
The only reason I brought up preferred values was because it established the premise that you used a potentiometer to pick a value by sight, not formula. I thought you admitted this, which would be telling to most technical people.
You're not gonna get away with that bullshit, slick! 1) You never said anything or indicated in the SLIGHTEST bit about EVER thinking it was a pot all along, you do so now the reviser that you are, 2) You started heckling on the "preferred value" issue BEFORE I ever even spoke to you, and 3) You know DAMN well what the symbol for a resistor is in a schematic! Let's refresh your memory:

Image

4) Where the F--K do you see a symbol for a potentiometer in that schematic, you lying liar ?? CLEAR resistor symbols are used!! And if not by the symbol, footnote #3 specifically refers to it as a resistor! You saw the 15 Ohm resistors, standard, you saw the 1000 Ohm resistors, standard, OK, but like a psycho hawk, you swooped down and caught that the 80 Ohm resistor didn't jive with the standard, wasn't 82 Ohms, etc. Amazing really! You REALLY had to be looking for things to find wrong with it if you ask me! Took it on like a mission and all the way to this sorry conclusion! Notice, you NEVER ONCE offered up the fact that 82 Ohms would've made it a "preferred value" - you just kept heckling on a technical point to harass, not till you posted the Wiki article and I had to read further! If I hadn't realized what happened, you would've gotten away with this! You have some kind of vindictive, sadistic personality and kept harassing with that, I think.

Anyway, yeah, there's no textual "pot" reference on that page where you saw my schematic and commented on it either. Maybe you just had the other kind of "pot" on the brain in general, what with the recent legalizations and the flood of pervasive media reports about it ?? Taken a few puffs in your time, have ya ??
kyuusaku wrote:Anyways since then you've admitted and demonstrated that you don't really know what you're doing, so we can drop it.
You're so disgustingly contemptible! Go f--k yourself, you sorry ass bigot! Yes, because of a lacking footnote to keep a nitpicking nutjob in check, I totally "don't really know what I'm doing," etc. So yeah, where are those clever 75 Ohm resistors on that RCA DVD module of mine, in your a$$hole ?? Where they hiding ? Where are they in my SNES unit for that matter ?? Eh, chief ?? It's hard to believe you'd still try to be this arrogant, but yeah, wow! Not a single ounce of humility whatsoever, none that I can see!
kyuusaku wrote:Next time maybe put a disclaimer so people don't assume.
What the f--k have I been saying multiple times now ? How many times did I repeatedly point that out, for nitpicking nutjobs like yourself, it was an oversight on my part and I had no idea it'd be something for someone like you to grab on to the way that you did for your attacks! You apparently either skim in your reading or just bullshit. Naw, you must've read it, just playing stupid. Yeah, I'll label details like that next time, I meant to, but how about you not try going off on assumptive limbs, latching on to something like a steel trap and playing it for all that it's worth, how about that ? Maybe probe/ask questions first before taking your disrespectful, alienating approach, one of my original points with what's wrong with you ? Of course, that'd asking way too much of you, but anyway, won't be my damn problem.
kyuusaku wrote:It's not. I don't know the specifics and I haven't talked to this guy in ages. At the time he felt bullied and shared his sentiments in our chatroom.
Oh OK, sure. First it was vaguely about crediting and now about bullying. Oh hey, I know a mystery guy from 5 years ago that says you suck ballz, how about that ?
kyuusaku wrote:"We never would have communicated". I know you can follow sentence to sentence.
Hah, alright, so you got one there. Forgive me, as your other proofreading failures led me to think that was another one, great sentences like this, "but through your posts you have projecting these attributes onto myself", etc. It wasn't that long of a post, so I know you can do better than that, kyuu.
kyuusaku wrote:
Likewise! Like you think you're gonna hurt with me that.
You claimed I had a hard-on for you (assuming I'm male), as if I'm knowledgeable about you and/or have some ulterior motive for my posts. I don't, and I need to clear that up for posterity.
I thought you might've had a prior grudge. It was a guess, you didn't, you're just a general a$$hole, so fairy enough. You already answered that this wasn't the case and that was not the issue of response, what you quoted there. You indicated "I know very little about you personally--and I'm more than fine with that.", and I noted that the feeling is simply mutual, I too would've preferred to have never met you and not ever have to deal with you again! You're that despicable to me!
kyuusaku wrote:So far I haven't received any on-topic (about the driver) criticism from you. You've tried to disrepute my criticisms with anecdotes, but you haven't presented anything I can even reflect upon because nothing has challenged my understanding of the electronics. I'm always eager to learn something new.
Wow. Just wow. OK, bye-bye then.
kyuusaku wrote:
It's a basic transistor amp and yes, it actually does amplify the signals in question.
Sort of and no. The signal in question is represented by voltage. The transistor is arranged as a "voltage follower". The transistor's job in this arrangement is to transform impedance; it's an analog voltage buffer. The signal out is actually smaller than what went in due to the non-linearity of real transistors. It's an amplifier in the sense that it allows for a high impedance signal to drive a low impedance load, "amplifying" the signal/voltage source's current capacity, by lowering its impedance, but it does not amplify the signal's amplitude.

This would pertinent information for somebody considering modding their console because what they want (a compliant driver) has voltage gain to achieve the correct output impedance.
So you wanna stop the widespread use of the phrase "transistor amp" because the way that the signal is made more powerful is not by the signal's amplitude, but by the method that you described ? I dunno, you just wanna dump detailed knowledge to flaunt your education level on the subject matter at times. Yeah, it would appear to be pertinent and useful if you're a trained EE with the capacity to make use of that knowledge, sounds like. But that's not what most of us are... Thanks, I guess ? :roll: Alright, wow, making progress here!! Now we can design the best circuit ever!
kyuusaku wrote:
but it's acceptable.
It's really not considering that all current is supplied through the 7805 which regulates voltage by burning up excess power. Plus you even mentioned that the transistors got hot... This would be why.
Take it up with SNES engineers, as I said. The transistors get just as hot if you wired them up without a cap/pull-down resistor, just wiring the emitter to a series resistor on to the TV. It's more to do with the 5 Volts that is powering it.
kyuusaku wrote:
That's the range SNES engineers used for Luma/Y, so it's wasn't this great offense that you claim that it is!
(Once AGAIN) it's all about the biasing. If your signal has a significant DC offset, which it does, it *is* a great offense to waste current with an arbitrarily small emitter resistor.
The Red-Y and Blue-Y pins on the video chip are right next to the Luma/Y pin, and I recall the DC offsets being pretty similar or not that far apart. I'd have to verify again for sure, but yeah. We know that you don't know exactly what it is for Luma and if they're all about the same, than your heckling was worthless for sure. Let's not forget your schizophrenia with this issue, on one hand, blindly stating that 80 Ohms is too low, wastes loads of current, on the other hand, stating this, "If it's dropped to 75 ohms then it also serves as a parallel source termination." suggesting to go lower to meet the 75 Ohm standard.

The other issue is that we're talking about a "DC offset" - That's something different than a genuine DC Voltage. It can't carry a load... As my old schematic reported, Red-Y/Blue-Y is at 3 Volts, but I couldn't actually power a 3 VDC device with any of those pins if I connected one up, could I ?? I couldn't power a little flash light with that, could I ?? I tried, it does nothing!

I tried to get an explanation about a DC offset from steve, but I didn't quite understand him, other than what I have already just stated. I understand that it's not quite a 3 VDC power source, just because my DMM reads 3.XX Volts on it! It's something different, so I understand it up to that point, that it can't "carry a load." So the point about "wasting loads of current," becomes more suspect to me, because it's not a genuine 3 VDC source, it's a DC offset of 3 V and it's different. I can't even cause a spark with it if I ground it, I can't f--king power a 3 Volt little light bulb with it either, so how am I gonna be wasting "loads of current" with it ?? I would guess *something*, but "loads ??" Come on... Even though my DMM says 3.XX Volts, it's not a genuine 3 Volt DC supply, I can't power ANYTHING with it, even if it was a 1 Volt light bulb or some other light weight electrical device! Maybe I can power a cheap dollar store calculator with it ?
kyuusaku wrote:
Strawman.
No. You completely changed your tune once you realized the value of 75 ohms has some sort of significance, that is the theory you called nitpicking.
False! I haven't "completely" or even "slightly" changed my tune at all, that's your pathetic assertion/generalization and you have tried many on me! I simply told you why and how I picked that 80 Ohm resistor! Take it or leave it! My resistor pack only had 68 Ohm to 82 Ohm ranges, so I took an 82 Ohm resistor, measured it on a DMM, reported the 80 Ohms on the schematic, and that's what I used! Call me a liar, but I trust most people will see through your pathetic bullshit! You're just showing that you don't like being proven wrong about your original assumptions/assertions, so you'll hold onto them like a steel trap! P.S. I never learned or realized the value of 75 Ohms because of you, that happened long before EVER arriving in this thread and getting heckled down by you! Pretty arrogant to have assumed as such!

You, on the other hand, have wildly over-emphasized the importance of the 75 Ohm resistor as I've felt and stated as such. 1) You claimed I would find one on that DVD output module of mine, so I checked every one, and sure enough, did NOT find a single one. 2) You claimed that the final output series resistor should blindly be 75 Ohms, and yet not a single transistor amp on the SNES unit followed this! The Luma uses 39 Ohms, the Composite 56 Ohms, and the Chroma 100 Ohms, etc.!!!!! 3) Point 2 had the effect of sending people off on wild goose chases making them believe that they had to amplify the source signal just right, so that the final attenuation needed to be 75 Ohms. That would need something like increasing the power to the transistor, adding another or whatever the hell else, and I don't find you to be correct on that issue in the slightest damn bit. You're one guy, and a prick at that, and tons of circuits on the net and what's on the SNES itself disagree with you, so you have less credibility as far as I'm concerned! I'm sorry you call that arrogance on my part and can't see it as a problem of your own!

For my part, way back in this thread, I stated that when it came to input modules on your TV, there's gonna be a 75 Ohm resistor right there at the female RCA jacks for sure! That's where the usage is 100% guaranteed and needed for this standard as far as what I can tell from my observations and not just being told by you that usage should be everywhere, blindly even on output modules, etc. You want me to just take your word for things cause you have some kind of EE training or something and the amazing level of pride and arrogance that has come with it, and yet I've done what most people should do in principle, get second opinions, third, etc. consider multiple sources!
kyuusaku wrote:Also it isn't just a difference of 1-2 ohms, because your "79 ohms" figure is wrong; the resistors you're referring to are not equivalent to your emitter resistor, plus for the final time, the Re value in one circuit isn't necessarily appropriate in another circuit. *refer back to biasing*
1) The figure is correct, and yes, they are just about equivalent because together they create a path to ground with about 79 Ohms in resistance to the emitter. 2) I don't need you to tell me these things, these redundant lectures of yours that one circuit component choice isn't necessarily appropriate in another circuit! Did you see me use 39 Ohms as an output series resistor as the Luma circuit does ? Nope! You didn't! I used 15 Ohms originally!

Try, try to understand how ridiculous you look to me! Please just try! I am not a trained EE, so I have to look at other professional circuits and learn from the experience of others as a starting point! To design something that gets me started, that works! That is the best that I can do! I've had to pester a real EE to learn from him as much as I could, and if he had his own SNES, he would've done it for me by now! I f--king understand that the choice of 470 Ohms between the chip and the transistor's base was to "condition" the signal somehow right before amplification, I didn't ever need a nutjob to tell me this! Or them using 200 Ohms as the pull-down resistor for Chroma! I don't have a scope, I'll never understand video signals at this depth and level, so stop judging me under the lens of some kind of professionally trained EE or whatever the hell you are, you egotistical monster!

The whole idea with that basic transistor amp guide was to have something temporary, to spread the word, get people started on this with something that works decently enough, albeit a WIP, that's about it, along with hopefully attracting a professional EE to finish the f--king job and do it f--king right!

So, looking for a 75 Ohm resistor for the pull-down, having only 80-82 resistors available, that was simply just a starting point for me. That's the best that I can do! What the hell else would you expect ?? And then seeing that the native Luma circuit uses 79 Ohms, that let's me know I'm in the right starting range at least. Sure, doesn't mean that it's the perfect choice, but probably a good indicator of what the minimum should be, given the other native circuits only go higher to 100 or 200 Ohms. The point is, f--k the hell off and that you really NEVER told me ANYTHING that I didn't already know! Only thing I learned from you was the "preferred value" standard and realizing that's what guided resistor manufacturing. How f--king useful was that ??? Pffffft.

kyuusaku wrote:
I simply pointed out that the first schematic of mine that he shared here was done so privately via PM, and I wasn't quite confident enough with it to share publicly since I was still experimenting.
That's fine, but my point wasn't about him, it's about you vehemently defending the circuit over the experience of others.
F--k your other point and what was really your other point, etc. Rinse and repeat! You claimed I "threw him under the bus" just for pointing out that I didn't feel that original schematic was ready for public display. But as to that point, it's only YOUR experience that is the issue, the troll in a thread, and yeah, I HAVE defended the circuit using the experience of others, you know, ROHM and SNES engineers, and even RCA engineers, etc.!
kyuusaku wrote:
I changed the default output resistances as well relative to my 1990 motherboard obviously.
In a properly designed circuit, this wouldn't be necessary.
Um, it's not gonna be 75 Ohms exactly, buddy, whatever it's gonna be on the series output! I have no scope, so it's gonna have to be a TV or some other type of device (USB to YPbPr) and I'm not a trained electrical engineer. This process is the only way for an average Joe with some kind of knowledge to design some working circuit. Amazing that this is so hard for him to understand, I really don't get it. I understand that you hate that this is the case, but golly, too f--king bad!
kyuusaku wrote:
you got ONE PM
This is true, I misspoke. Wasn't intending to exaggerate.
Woah, I don't believe it. One concession, but yet on the least important or relevant issue. It's a start at least.
kyuusaku wrote:
Oh, I see, so now we're making assumptions about other people
Not assumptions.
Oooooh, I see.
kyuusaku wrote:No I was hoping you'd consider the possibility that this thread isn't reflecting well upon you. I realize that it's turned unbecoming of me for numerous reasons.
I'll worry about me, you worry about you! This isn't some "show" for me, this forum seemed kind of dead to me really. I dunno, but I figure an admin or mod would've told me to f--k off by now unless they've been finding this entertaining or never noticed it. I'd understand either way.
kyuusaku wrote:
took an 82 Ohm resistor out of it, measured it with a DMM at 80 Ohms
OK, if you say so.
Yeah, I do say so, cause that's exactly what happened. Sorry you don't like the full story proving you wrong after it's fully revealed.
kyuusaku wrote:
I was looking for a 75 Ohm resistor just because of some general knowledge as a layman about the 75 Ohm standard for video signals
Come on...
Come on WHAT ? You think I ever needed you to learn something about it before ever even attempting my own circuit ? Before ever coming here ?
kyuusaku wrote:
And given all the motherboard revisions, and other factors, etc. you're gonna want a 0-100 Ohm pot for that aspect.
With a reasonable design (preferrably op amp/negative-feedback) no tweaking is necessary because it will conform to established standards.
For someone telling me to respect your experience, you keep revealing signs of lacking hands-on experience.

1) You don't know the current signal strength levels of the Red-Y and Blue-Y pins between the 1990-1993 boards/chips. In my case, it turned out the Blue-Y doesn't need amp'ing, and there's a strength imbalance as Mike Moffit had already pointed out.

2) Final output series resistor: The Luma amp uses 39 Ohms, the Composite amp 56 Ohms, and the Chroma amp 100 Ohms, (OH MY GAWWD, those bastards, where IS that elusive 75 Ohm resistor hiding ??) as stated, and with the same 5 Volt powered transistors. The idea the some op-amp or whatever else, would take the Red-Y and Blue-Y pins as input off this VERY SAME video chip, and magically amplify them just right so that you could blindly slap on a 75 Ohm output series resistor is ignorant! You're gonna have to tweak somehow with a scope or your TV! We can't do it with a scope, buddy, us non-engineers!

3) For the last time: We're not expert circuit designers with formal EE training, stop judging me or anybody else under this damn lens of yours! If a professional with a SNES unit would've cracked it open and done it already, it'd be F--KING DONE, END OF THE STORY, WE wouldn't have to waste our f--king time with this, with something like YOU, etc.! I would like to see a professional EE design a basic transistor amp like the native ones that I revealed here - I will happily use such a design and thank that person and be done with it. Until that happens, I will have to settle for "tweaking" or "fiddling" when I have the inclination to do so again. Meanwhile, you STILL did manage to find the time to keep posting in here, but NEVER to actually DO IT yourself with your great knowledge and expertise! Thanks, a$$hole! Heckling for you has been far more fun I suspect!
My Ys Fan Translation Projects.
http://www.ysutopia.net/

tepples
Posts: 22014
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 11:12 pm
Location: NE Indiana, USA (NTSC)
Contact:

Re: YPbPr ouput mod for SNES consoles

Post by tepples » Fri Feb 07, 2014 8:24 am

This topic has become way out of hand. Feel free to start a new topic when you have an EE working on this.

Image
Talk to the tummy.

Locked