NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Discuss technical or other issues relating to programming the Nintendo Entertainment System, Famicom, or compatible systems.

Moderator: Moderators

Bananmos
Posts: 468
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 9:08 am
Contact:

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by Bananmos » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:48 pm

Doesn't Study Hall use the self-flashable configuration? Or do you specifically mean free-to-download NES software supporting self-flashable mapper 30?
Free-to-download would be better, but thanks for letting me know about study hall. I might order in place of the test ROM then, and see if Tapedump can substitute for a Kazzoo dumper. :)
The free test option is emulators. (Is relying on a PowerPak or Everdrive emulation of flash ROM behaviour really any better than an emulator?
In my opinion, yes. But it varies greatly depending on how much you are pushing the system. And arguably emulators are very advanced now and suffice for most uses. I mostly use them myself now, whereas ten years ago I would be primarily using the real system.

And yes, Powerpak/Everdrive have the main weakness of being an imperfect clone of the particular mapper you're using. But mapper behaviour is less likely to be a critical part of your game design than PPU/APU quirks.

But there is also something special about seeing your game actually run on the real system - even knowing it should match emulation, it's only when you see it running on the real thing that I truly get the "yeah, this really does run on my childhood fav console!"-feeling". It's a motivational boost that is more about emotion than logic. But your mileage may vary here, of course.

User avatar
MistSonata
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 9:59 am

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by MistSonata » Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:20 pm

Bananmos wrote:MistSonata: Did you have success trying the newer firmware for the AVS? I don't have any direct plans to buy an AVS in the near future, so there's not much I can do to test it. But it would be nice if we could figure out what the problem is.
I tried running the rom before and after updating the AVS, and then before and after updating the Everdrive firmware (with a format and reinstall afterwards, just to be thorough). Nothing changed that I could see, best I could get was a black screen.

User avatar
rainwarrior
Posts: 7680
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:03 pm
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by rainwarrior » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:32 pm

Bananmos wrote:And yes, Powerpak/Everdrive have the main weakness of being an imperfect clone of the particular mapper you're using. But mapper behaviour is less likely to be a critical part of your game design than PPU/APU quirks.
Oh, I meant for testing flash. You can still test all the PPU/APU stuff without flash saves. You can even test loading a save without flash emulation (just put the data in the ROM).

Of course it'd be nice to be able to test everything at once, but at least flash saving tends to be a pretty isolated task (like you probably don't want to be doing much else at the same time anyway).

robocop
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:20 am

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by robocop » Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:49 pm

Sonny_Jim wrote:https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13 ... -required/

This seems to be utter bullshit. Thoughts? Does Joe post on here at all?
NestorLab is Free man,and every body can download it,and with no coding,and for NES Homebrew.
but this is very expensive.

User avatar
dougeff
Posts: 2617
Joined: Fri May 08, 2015 7:17 pm
Location: DIGDUG
Contact:

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by dougeff » Mon Apr 02, 2018 7:00 pm

NestorLab...is in version 0.0.1. Looks like a text editor and a title editor. No examples. No documents. No comments from the author in over a year.

And the screenshot of the ASM code makes me very nervous "BPL -5". So...no labels then? Am I to calculate branches manually? No thanks.

http://nestorlab.free.fr/screenshot.php
nesdoug.com -- blog/tutorial on programming for the NES

robocop
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:20 am

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by robocop » Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:11 am

dougeff wrote:NestorLab...is in version 0.0.1. Looks like a text editor and a title editor. No examples. No documents. No comments from the author in over a year.

And the screenshot of the ASM code makes me very nervous "BPL -5". So...no labels then? Am I to calculate branches manually? No thanks.

http://nestorlab.free.fr/screenshot.php
Kickstarter NESMaker is to new and there is no tutorials.

User avatar
FrankenGraphics
Formerly WheelInventor
Posts: 2032
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2016 2:55 am
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Contact:

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by FrankenGraphics » Tue Apr 03, 2018 8:35 am

Actually, Joe from the NESmaker team has already started doing video tutorials for absolute beginners. They will surely explain the user interface in proper time for the release. It's my personal projection but it wouldn't surprise me if it came with a decent reference + faq to ease the pressure of questions from users.

Given that NESmaker is not released just yet (there's a closed beta going on just now), that's pretty cool.

Consider this: NESmaker has an anticipated install base of 2,500 users (that's how many who backed the project, at least). It is as good a guarantee it will be maintained and have a community of users supporting each other. I'm under the impression there's a pretty lively discussion group on facebook, and someone has started an independent BBS for its users, all before its release.

+, it comes with a handful of engine modules to learn from, modify or simply use as-is (which it is being advertised for).

NestorLab seems to have a user base of... maybe the author, if not abandoned? Not being avaible in english is of course the authors rightful choice too, but to me it kind of comes off as a signal that the author isn't interested in having a userbase except for his/her own needs. In other words: don't expect support or development.

It doesn't seem to do anything NESICIDE already does, which has at least a few users, and a maintainer who's actively asked on the forums for suggestions for improvements. If you're looking for free alternatives providing a bit of an GUI helped environment, that might be worth checking out.

Most people here seem to stick with asm6 or ca65 / cc65 (which NESICIDE and apparently NestorLab is built on top of). Still others use NESASM. Honourable mention: Ophis, an assembler written in python. Few use it, but it works just fine.
http://www.frankengraphics.com - personal NES blog

robocop
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:20 am

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by robocop » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:04 am

FrankenGraphics wrote:Actually, Joe from the NESmaker team has already started doing video tutorials for absolute beginners. They will surely explain the user interface in proper time for the release. It's my personal projection but it wouldn't surprise me if it came with a decent reference + faq to ease the pressure of questions from users.

Given that NESmaker is not released just yet (there's a closed beta going on just now), that's pretty cool.

Consider this: NESmaker has an anticipated install base of 2,500 users (that's how many who backed the project, at least). It is as good a guarantee it will be maintained and have a community of users supporting each other. I'm under the impression there's a pretty lively discussion group on facebook, and someone has started an independent BBS for its users, all before its release.

+, it comes with a handful of engine modules to learn from, modify or simply use as-is (which it is being advertised for).

NestorLab seems to have a user base of... maybe the author, if not abandoned? Not being avaible in english is of course the authors rightful choice too, but to me it kind of comes off as a signal that the author isn't interested in having a userbase except for his/her own needs. In other words: don't expect support or development.

It doesn't seem to do anything NESICIDE already does, which has at least a few users, and a maintainer who's actively asked on the forums for suggestions for improvements. If you're looking for free alternatives providing a bit of an GUI helped environment, that might be worth checking out.

Most people here seem to stick with asm6 or ca65 / cc65 (which NESICIDE and apparently NestorLab is built on top of). Still others use NESASM. Honourable mention: Ophis, an assembler written in python. Few use it, but it works just fine.
But The Money,The Software Is Very Expensive,When I Talk with NESTorLab project Maker He Taled me That The Software Will Have Tutorials In The Future.

8bitMicroGuy
Posts: 314
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2015 12:23 pm
Location: Croatia

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by 8bitMicroGuy » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:05 am

I don't fully understand this. So will NESMaker be free or paid or both? Will making commercial games require paying for a license or royalties?

robocop
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:20 am

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by robocop » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:19 am

8bitMicroGuy wrote:I don't fully understand this. So will NESMaker be free or paid or both? Will making commercial games require paying for a license or royalties?
Here Is The Image Of chating with The NesTorLab Programmer.
He telled Me With French That The Software is in development and it doesn't be completed yet because there is another important projects,and the project development is paused,the develompent will be in the next years.and there will be a tutorials in the next moments,he tell that the tutorials will be in an another doublage.
that's it.
Attachments
Sans titre.png
Last edited by robocop on Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
FrankenGraphics
Formerly WheelInventor
Posts: 2032
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2016 2:55 am
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Contact:

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by FrankenGraphics » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:21 am

8bitMicroGuy wrote:I don't fully understand this. So will NESMaker be free or paid or both?
Paid, 36$ for the tool + example code modules.
Will making commercial games require paying for a license or royalties?
Nah, it's a one-time purchase for a license to the NESmaker software itself. Generous nes source modules included.
http://www.frankengraphics.com - personal NES blog

robocop
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2018 4:20 am

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by robocop » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:25 am

FrankenGraphics wrote:
8bitMicroGuy wrote:I don't fully understand this. So will NESMaker be free or paid or both?
Paid, 36$ for the tool + example code modules.
Will making commercial games require paying for a license or royalties?
Nah, it's a one-time purchase for a license to the NESmaker software itself. Generous nes source modules included.
Ok Have No Fear there is The hackers!!!!!

User avatar
Punch
Posts: 351
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2013 11:52 am

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by Punch » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:27 am

robocop wrote:
FrankenGraphics wrote:
8bitMicroGuy wrote:I don't fully understand this. So will NESMaker be free or paid or both?
Paid, 36$ for the tool + example code modules.
Will making commercial games require paying for a license or royalties?
Nah, it's a one-time purchase for a license to the NESmaker software itself. Generous nes source modules included.
Ok Have No Fear there is The hackers!!!!!
Have fun hacking your way out of court.
This is a block of text that can be added to posts you make. There is a 255 character limit.

User avatar
FrankenGraphics
Formerly WheelInventor
Posts: 2032
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2016 2:55 am
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
Contact:

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by FrankenGraphics » Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:34 am

??? 36$ is a very reasonable price. It's basically 3-4 pies of pizza. More importantly, it's honest work made by homebrew community members. Please don't disrespect it by talking about pirating it...
http://www.frankengraphics.com - personal NES blog

User avatar
dougeff
Posts: 2617
Joined: Fri May 08, 2015 7:17 pm
Location: DIGDUG
Contact:

Re: NESMaker Kickstarter - Make NES games without coding

Post by dougeff » Tue Apr 03, 2018 11:01 am

I have also talked with the creator of nestorlab, user name schade at this forum. He seems very knowledgeable and I believe he will try to make his project work. One day.

And I have spoken to Joe, currently making NESmaker. He has more resources (the kickstarter $), and is using a well known assembler (asm6) and I have seen his beta version working (YouTube).

NESmaker has already made a game. That says a lot. Maybe there will be some bumps on the road, but it helps that hundreds of people will be using NESmaker and helping each other out.

I may purchase NESmaker in the future.
nesdoug.com -- blog/tutorial on programming for the NES

Post Reply